I welcome Brian Gryn, long-time trainer and coach, an expert in all things fasting and strength training, and host of the Get Lean, Eat Clean podcast to the show for a conversation about evolving fitness strategies and effective fat loss methods.

We talk about how to identify the exact elements of your lifestyle that are sabotaging your weight loss efforts, whether it’s diet, lack of accountability or lack of belief in yourself (or something else that you haven’t yet realized) as well as how to most effectively create practical strategies that actually work for you. Brian then breaks down the many benefits that come with taking a minimal approach to high-intensity training and we discuss the importance of utilizing the Carnivore Scores guide in order to maximize the nutrient density of your diet. We also touch on the topic of snacking, and Brian explains why it can be helpful to eradicate this habit if you are not yet at the point where you feel like you can eat just two meals a day.


A minimal approach to training can generate huge results. [02:06]

It is believed that one burns the same number of calories each day whether we exercise or not. [08:23]

There is a mental side of dealing with excess weight that is important to look at. [09:27]

There may be a part of you thinking that you don’t deserve to change. [12:48]

Having a third party work with you is helpful. [14:41]

What has Brian seen with his clients that really didn’t click? [17:41]

People rarely change their minds. [20:05]

One does not need to work out for hours to have an effective workout. [22:13]

You don’t want to mix the effort to get stronger while you’re also playing sports. [26:30]

Slow it down and see the difference. [32:10]

You really have to get the lifestyle changes around exercise nailed down before you can tweak your diet.  [44:16]

To broaden your dietary choices, look at the inexpensive SMASH family. (Sardines, Mackerel, Anchovies, Salmon and Herring.) [45:36]

Eating grass-fed and pasture-raised nutrient dense food is the goal. [48:53]

How frequently we eat is something to look at. And how about eliminating snacking? [53:25]

Anything with calories counts as breaking a fast. [58:49]

Everything in moderation is not a good motto. That is talking about still allowing the toxic chemicals in the standard diet to come into our bodies. [01:02:01]

Clean out your cupboard of the temptations. [ 01:05:34]



Download the episode audio by clicking the arrow in the top right corner of the player above.

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B.Rad Podcast

Brad (00:01:10):
Hey listeners. It’s a pleasure to welcome my podcasting counterpart Brian Gryn, host of the Get Lean, Eat Clean podcast. He’s a longtime coach and trainer based out of Chicago, expert in fasting and strength training, and also a top champion golfer. So we didn’t even get to the diversion subject of speed golf. So imagine that we had so much to talk about with fitness and diet. So we kind of hit the hot button items, Some of the new ideas and bounce those around, back and forth for this syndicated podcast. So you can go listen to the Get Lean, Eat Clean podcast. Brian is on the board now he hit his hundredth show recently. So we talked about some of his favorite insights that he’s learned from his many popular guests. He recorded a two part episode where he talked about this highlights himself. And boy, we cover a lot here.

Brad (00:02:06):
It’s a wide ranging conversation, but one of the big areas of focus is this new idea that a minimal approach to training can generate huge results, especially with the idea of getting stronger. And this has been conveyed by leaders such as Dr. John Jaquish inventor of the X three bar former podcast guest for both of us actually. He’s also the inventor of OsteoStrong, which is a chain of specialized fitness facilities that helps the elderly preserve bone density and strength. Very successfully partnered with Tony Robbins. They’re all over the country. The world the X three bar has been a sensation, especially during quarantine for people to get a total body workout, very challenging total body workout at home. Along with Dr. Jaquish’s insights, we bring in kind of a big picture perspective. Some other top names that are promoting this similar idea of a minimalist approach to high intensity training.

Brad (00:03:02):
Dr. Doug McGuff my recent podcast guest and his book Body by Science, Dr. Craig Marker, my recent podcast guest and his breakthrough concept of high intensity repeat training. We also talk about Dr. Ted Naiman, recent podcast guest author of the PE ratio diet, and his contention that a great workout consists of going and doing a single set of a certain exercise to absolute muscular failure only takes what less than a minute to do as many pull ups as you can. Then you take a little breath, go outside, sprint up a hill in your neighborhood once, and then maximum effort sprint return, maybe do a set of pushups, a single set to total muscular failure, and you are good to go and same with Dr. McGuff ‘s work. Uh, he talks about his big five workout, which I’ve been enthusiastically testing out for now.

Brad (00:03:53):
I think I’m a couple months trying to get over to the gym once a week to do five total body exercises. One set to total muscular failure at that super slow pace. And we talk about the slowing down of the strength training rep to put the muscle under a prolonged resistance load and how difficult that is and how safe and effective that is. So you can’t believe kind of difficult workout you can get in in only 12 minutes. And in Dr. McGuff subtitle to the book, it says 12 minutes a week to get stronger and more powerful. Pretty mind blowing. Makes you wonder what you’re doing in the gym, those other five days a week, where you spend an hour. And Brian does bring up some interesting counter opinions. And just trying to sort everything out, how to divide between the specific and narrow fitness goal of getting stronger muscles versus building broad-based fitness competency, things you do at a CrossFit workout where you become good at climbing up a rope, because it’s a wonderful, valuable skill.

Brad (00:04:57):
Same with me going out there and jumping and sprinting. I love to do it. I do feel like those are valuable human skills to develop. But they certainly don’t equate to the pure straightforward goal of getting a stronger muscle, which is of great importance to a variety of people, especially, oh my gosh, the osteo strong results are phenomenal. My mom in the senior citizen category has joined and continues to put up bigger results every week, even though she only goes once a week and the workout only lasts a few minutes, Hey, something’s gotta be working there. So Brian and I will talk further about this concept. But I wanted to tee that up for you as we get into it. And then we transition gracefully over into the world of diet, losing excess fat, the confusion that surrounds this prominent goal for many people and how to sort through some basic strategies that’ll work really well for you.

Brad (00:05:50):
We talk about fasting. We talk about time restricted feeding. We talk about eating fewer meals and eating less frequently. As you can see on the video, my Two Meals a Day book in the background to prompt the conversation and especially interesting is this overall goal that I would say is probably my number one dietary goal now. And that is to maximize the nutrient density of my diet. And Brian gave me a nice plug for the Carnivore Scores Food Rankings Chart that I developed with Kate Cretsinger. And you can find for free@bradkerns.com. So if you haven’t downloaded that and printed out the pretty full color, uh, graph and taped it on your refrigerator, please do so immediately. Surprisingly, we hear a lot about budget talk when, and, uh, we’re trying to strive for healthy eating and people complaining, and it’s so expensive to buy those grass-fed steaks.

Brad (00:06:43):
I hear ya. I feel ya. Uh, but if you look at the ranking chart carefully, and Brian pointed out that the, the SMASH fish category are pretty much the most affordable fish you can get and also happen to be the most healthy. Same with grass fed liver. It’s a few bucks, a pound it’s vastly less expensive than the more popular cuts that have significantly less nutritional value. So here we go with a couple podcasters coming atcha. It’s Brian Gryn and Brad Kearns. Take care. Thanks for listening, Brian Gryn. We are together again. We’ve had some great shows in the past and Get Lean, Eat Clean was once a dream. And now it is well entrenched as a hot new fitness podcast. I know you hit your a hundred show mark, so congratulations, and we’re gonna get into some important fitness and healthy living topics.

Brian (00:07:39):
Thanks, Brad. So this is fun. This is like a, what like a dual podcast here. You got the B.rad

Brad (00:07:44):
Yeah, we’re gonna, we’re gonna syndicate this show and we’re gonna be, we’re gonna be chitchatting about all kinds of stuff. Uh, but what is, what’s the experience been like, uh, to get behind the microphone and launch this thing bold and bold and brave.` You went out there and stake your claim?

Brian (00:08:00):
Well, I, I have to credit you a little bit. You helped me get some guests to start out and all it takes is one or two, you know, guests, and then, you know, maybe some referrals after that. And, um, it’s been great. I love it. And I’m looking forward to the next year and, and not only getting great guests on my podcast, but also getting on some other podcasts, um, you know, out there as well, which will, which will be fun. So,

Brad (00:08:23):
So we’re probably gonna have the conversation divert to speed golf at some point because you have this great golf background, but I think the, the centerpiece of your operation, there is a long time in, in personal training and helping people, uh, get lean. So maybe we should kick the conversation off there because I’m kind of obsessed with this topic of how to drop excess body fat successfully and looking around and seeing all the different things that people are confused about. I tell the story on my show, The Fatty Popcorn Boy Saga, where I had to join, you know, instead of just talking about it and writing about it, I had to actually experience the challenge of dropping excess body fat that had creeped on without me really paying attention. And there’s a lot of different nuances. And I think some, some misunderstandings out there. We were just talking off the mic about Dr. Herman Pontzer’s book Burn, where he contends that we burn the same number of calories each day, whether we exercise or not. So the stuff starts to get pretty confusing for the average person.

Brian (00:09:27):
I mean, I agree. I think it can be confusing for anyone. Um, I think there’s a lot of misconceptions out there regarding losing weight at getting lean. You know, but I will say that one of the things I’ve learned and I had Drew Manning on my podcast, the Fit2Fat2Fit guy. He talked a lot about the mental side of, you know, the fact that he put on all this weight on purpose and that, and then wanted to obviously get it off. He’s done it twice. I think.

Brad (00:10:02):
That’s pretty amazing.

Brian (00:10:04):
It is. And I, and I give him credit cuz I don’t know if I would do that. Um, you know, he did it, you know? Sure. I’m sure he probably just did it. He wanted a way to relate with his clients. I think that’s pretty cool. And you know, it’s a sort of marketing idea as well. I’m sure that was part of it. But either way, to put that weight on and go through, like, I just think for me be the mental side of it. I would say now, if anything, the reason I’m, you know, I’m somewhat of a health nut is the fact that it makes me feel so much better. You and I just think that’s so important that if you get into the rhythm of creating these healthy habits that you’re hearing from all these podcasts and you realize that just mentally you’ll feel so much better day in, day out that you don’t wanna go back and go have, you know, Mont O’s, I don’t know, you don’t know Luman O’s pizza, but, uh, you don’t wanna have that deep dish cuz you know, how that’s gonna make you feel.

Brian (00:10:59):
And I don’t know. I just think, you know, and I know you’ve had plenty of guests on and you talk about sort of the mental side of it, but you know, I guess, what have you learned through that? Or what, are there any guests that you’ve had on that you’ve gained you know, some knowledge of regarding the mental side of losing or gaining?

Brad (00:11:15):
Oh man, you know that the, that whole story of Drew’s is really fascinating. And the one comment of his that stuck with me was what he, he purposely gained 60 pounds, right? And he was gonna do it. He thought it was gonna take six months and it took like 90 days or I forget what his thing was, but all of a sudden he is a fat guy. And he said, um, when he was walking around in town, whatever, he felt ashamed and he like embodied that person and that shamed that you know, society often, uh, heaps upon people who, uh, aren’t looking like, uh, the, the magazines and, and the TV actors. And he, he felt like, you know, he was in the supermarket and he wanted to scream out to everybody. Hey, I’m a super fit guy. Who’s just doing this experiment.

Brad (00:11:58):
And that to think about being in that mindset and how, you know, these, these limiting beliefs and things that we carry around inside, Hey, we’re not perfect looking or we’re, we’re not, we haven’t met all our goals, but now everyone can see that everywhere you go and you start to embody that personality. Boy, that’s pretty heavy because we don’t wanna do that. We want to consider excess body fat to be like a backpack that we’re carrying around due to the choices that we’ve made in the previous three years or 10 years. And it’s no big deal. It doesn’t have to be who we are. It’s just a situation that you know, we’re perfectly capable, uh, of managing and, and changing, um, just like changing clothes. And I think that would be the most empowering place to start from is to say, you know, I’m okay how I am now, I’m alive.

Brad (00:12:48):
I’m well, I’m breathing. And now I’m going to, you know, set a goal and go and manifest it and know where I’m headed really clearly. Dr. Bruce Lipton Biology of Belief, I just interviewed him and he was not necessarily talking about, uh, getting fit or losing excess body. In fact, that’s not his area of expertise, but when he talks about the, the combination of behavior patterns and wiring them into it with a clear vision and almost that manifesting world of setting your destination. You know, they talk about cutting the picture out of the magazine of this big, beautiful house. And I have a horse stables on the left and then I have a tennis court and a swimming pool, and I’m gonna manifest. Yeah, I’m gonna, I’m gonna put my dream board up. Right. So you put at the dream board up and a lot of people might have dream boards up where they have the picture of the guy with the six pack and they wanna look like that.

Brad (00:13:42):
But then in everyday life, they get in their own way because they don’t truly believe that they deserve to look like that or deserve to achieve that goal. Like I wanna be a par shooter on the golf course, man. And I’m very frustrated when I out there missing three foot putts and my score is going higher, but somewhere deep inside, I feel undeserving or unprepared or something’s in my way to where I’m not out on that first tee looking like Tiger Woods. And let me tell you, I’ve watched that guy up close at live tournaments. It’s very different than television when he was in his prime, him in the, you know, 2005, 6, 7, 8, 9. And you go up and, and look at his face from 10 feet away and how his brain’s calculating through the course and how confident and fearless he is. It’s I mean, you know, it’s awesome.

Brian (00:14:29):
I was gonna say, did you watch his son this weekend?

Brad (00:14:31):
I saw the clip there of the, the kid hitting a four iron. This little guy who’s only a bit talle. Than the four iron and he just rifles one at the pin. It was, it was amazing. Wow.

Brian (00:14:41):
Yeah. I mean talk about having some swag, I mean, um, but no, those are all good points. I think that also too, like having a coach, I don’t know if your guest talked about just having someone there that’s on your team, that’s holding you accountable day in, day out or week in, week out. I think that could be the missing piece to a lot of people’s, you know, like whatever health puzzle that they’re trying to solve. Because I mean, the information is out there, right. It can be confusing at times. Right? But I think most people know the difference between eating a donut and eating an apple. Like they know what’s healthy and what’s not for the most part. Right? But it’s not it’s, you know, part of it could be a lack of belief in themselves, but part of it could be the fact that they don’t have someone holding them accountable.

Brad (00:15:30):
Yeah. Great point and it’s, you know, answering to something bigger than yourself. And then even if the coach is even if the coach isn’t that good, right. If you sign up and hire a coach that shows something that you’re taking a stand and you’re serious about it, and you’re paying money out, I think there’s, um, that element too, or it’s gotta be, it’s gotta be important enough to, you know, actually worthy of a, of a budget outlay, and all those things are setting you up for success. Now if you have a great coach, you said, coach, if I say great coach, oh my gosh, then that’s a total game changer. But even someone who will just meet you at the park and get you going, It is so incredible, even if, you know, they leave you to their own devices and they’re not full of information and dispensing all these magical things.

Brad (00:16:21):
It’s just getting in that groove and that rhythm. And I needed to be better about that. Cuz um, with golf, I’m like, you know, I don’t need to nitpick my swing with the teacher three times a week. But with my Christopher Smith guy, he’s the greatest speed golfer of all time. And one of the top 50 Golf Digest teachers and long, long time career as a PGA professional. And just talking to him in a conversation on the phone, gets me in a more focused and empowered mindset because I’m, you know, listening to myself and I’ll utter a negative comment and he’ll catch me on that and say, you need to have more compassion for your mistakes on the golf course. And I’ll be like, wow. You know? Yeah. Why am I complaining so much when I can say I’m enjoying the process of getting better? Yeah. I missed a few, three footers, but I don’t have to beat myself up. I can look at it differently with his help to just open myself to bigger possibilities.

Brian (00:17:15):
Yeah. I mean, you know, having a third party is always helpful, whether it’s golf or health, I don’t know. I just, you know, I obviously I’m a little bit biased cuz you know, I that’s what I do. I coach a lot of males, mainly middle aged males and but you know, everyone needs someone on their side. That’s gonna be, that’s gonna help them through it. Cuz if, if you try doing it on your own, for the most part, you’ll fall back into your old habits, which is just human nature.

Brad (00:17:41):
So with your clients, what are some ways where you feel like you’ve been really effective and then what have you seen in terms of stuff that didn’t really click? Like you tried your hardest, you put it out there and what are those behavior patterns that you see come up where, uh, the person doesn’t succeed?

Brian (00:18:03):
Yeah. I think what, one of the things I’ve learned is you just sort of gotta meet people where they’re at and some people, you say something, you talk on the, you know, you, you talk once a week, let’s say and you, and you, you set some action items up and then the next week they do it. And then there’s others where that same action item is repeated over and over because they’ve, they’ve never, haven’t taken action. Um, so I think that, you know, yes, um, and talk til I’m blue in the face, but until they really understand, and this goes back to sort of Drew Manning until they can really understand why, why are we meeting? You know, why do they wanna take control of their health? Is it because they wanna play with their kids? Or I think you have to really dig into that level. Almost like the why game and figure out what’s truly moving them to take action until you can get to that. I mean, I can talk till I’m blue in the face and, and nothing’s gonna happen.

Brad (00:18:59):
And do you ever, um, kind of step into a confrontational encounter where you’re seeing the pattern repeat over and over? Maybe they’re not, oh yeah. I kind of blew that off. Uh, but this last week was really busy or they got an excuse every week. Does that ever happen or um, how does that go?

Brian (00:19:18):
So well I think what’s happened a little bit is a lot of my clients are there’s contradictions with what they’ve grown up thinking was healthy and what now is healthy. Like some of them think eggs aren’t healthy and, not only that, their doctor is telling them not to have so many, not to have eggs and to be on a statin, you know? And, and so I’m, so now I’m coming in and I’m contradicting what their health professionals maybe advised them over the years, maybe a low fat diet and things like that. You know, you gotta sort of tread lightly and, you know, I don’t wanna step on people’s toes and I can only say what, you know, what I think is right for that client and let them make the decision.

Brad (00:20:05):
Oh yeah, that’s a tough one, especially when you’re, you know, battling against one of the pillars of society, which is conventional medical care and medical information. Right. Um, and I think we’re Mark Manson, The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck, bestselling author. He says he cites research that getting people to change their mind is so incredibly rare and massively difficult, we have no idea. And generally when we’re arguing or making a convincing argument, we’re, we’re fighting on losing battle because people just very, very rarely change their mind from their fixed and rigid beliefs. And that includes the medical community and the process of science. I think it was Doug McGuff, we’re gonna talk about him shortly, but, um, he said, look, 20 years from now, all this ancestral stuff, whatever the broad pictures painting about how, you know, it, eggs are okay to eat and all the things that are being shaken up right now, he goes, it’s gonna take 20 years for mainstream to embrace this because that’s how slowly science moves and industry and, you know is changing.

Brad (00:21:19):
He goes, I just wanna be ahead of the curve. I don’t know about you, but I don’t wanna wait that long. And that was a nice kind way of saying, you know, the medical system is backwards and screwed up and terrible and they’re, they’re all wrong. He, wasn’t saying that at all. He was just saying that things move really slowly. And if you wanna be ahead of the game, let’s take a look at some of this emerging science and you know, try to stay on top of things. Same with fitness.

Brian (00:21:44):
Yeah, no, I agree. I mean, I think, um, you know, talking about Doug McGuff, um, and his I’m actually reading his book right now and I’m, I know you’ve had him on you’ve also had other people who probably have some differing opinions on, let’s just say, frequency of workout. And, let’s just say intensity and, you know, time under tension and things like that. It can and confuse a podcast host, Brad. I’m not sure that’s so fun.

Brad (00:22:12):
That’s what we gotta get into today, man.

Brian (00:22:13):
Right. I mean, so I, you know, and it’s for myself, you know working with the X three over the last couple years and having Dr. John Jaquish which is there’s a similar philosophy are right between McGuff and what Jaquish talks about with his 10 minutes a day in the X three. And for me as a traditional bodybuilder, weight lifter for 20 years, 20 plus years, it definitely took me time to understand that as long. Yeah. Like that may to be, I don’t need to work out as much and I can be just as effective. I don’t need to be sore and I could build muscle. And I’m, I’m actually learning that. I’ve learned that over the last couple years.

Brad (00:22:58):
Yeah. This is a really fascinating breakthrough in fitness that I see happening recently. And we could kind of group together to make a big picture here. When we, we talk about Body by Science with Doug McGuff and John Little and John Jaquish’s X three bar, who’s all over Instagram, touting his very brief, but extremely challenging workout and Dr. Ted Naiman, the PE Ratio Diet, and he’s also pretty prominent in Instagram advocating these single set to complete muscular failure in a single workout. So he’s saying like, get up there and get on the pullup bar and do as many as you can until you drop. And you could do a short rest and then go sprint once up a hill in your neighborhood and then come back and do one set of pushups and these types of workouts where you’re fatiguing the muscle completely.

Brad (00:23:53):
Uh, just like Dr. Jaquish talks about where he’s doing the variable resistance and the decrease range of motion until you can absolutely not even stretch the bar at all because your muscles are completely torched. It’s really fascinating to me how the, the idea is that you’re gonna make quick strength, breakthroughs with very minimal duration workouts. And we’ll pause there, but then the follow up is what the heck are we doing in the gym for hours and hours, but what do you think about the, the overall premise of, you know, prompting strength gains with a workout that’s in Doug McGuff case? He says 12 minutes a week. Is the subtitle on his book, 12 minutes a week people?

Brian (00:24:35):
Well, yeah, I, my thought around that is I think if you focus on the eccentric motion more when you’re doing these, these weight lifting routines throughout the week, um, I think that can go a long way and eccentric essentially is the lowering of the weight. So like, you know, I’ve been doing with the X three is trying to count, you know, five, I’d say five to eight seconds as I’m concentric llifting the weight, and then, and then letting it I’m down another so five to eight seconds. And, and the idea, and McGuff talks about this and his book is no momentum, no swinging. You’r e under tension the entire time. And it’s almost the thought of, and I might start doing this is timing, how long it takes you. I think in the book, it talks about like 60 to 90 seconds of time under tension for that, for that muscle, um, as opposed to worrying about sets and reps, which I, which is most traditional lifters do and what I did forever, just trying to hammer through it as fast as possible, not even focusing on the eccentric motion of the exercise, but, um, I think that can go a long way.

Brian (00:25:47):
You know, I’m, I’m still, I know Dr. Doug McGuff talks about one like seven days of rest. I, I don’t know, I’m not quite there. I’m not quite there. I actually sent a message to someone that I had on my podcast, his name’s Eugene Liauw. But, he was just sending me back his thoughts on that, which don’t agree at that, as far as hypertrophy training, that you would need more than one a week workout. So, you know, I know there’s science maybe both ways, and maybe it just depends on what you’re using as your lifting platform and, you know, and, and how great of a stimuli that that is to make that decision.

Brad (00:26:30):
Well, for me, it’s helpful to understand first off the, the context and in John Jaquish’s case, Doug McGuff’s case, they’re talking about getting the muscle stronger, period. So increasing muscle strength, and that’s quite different and disparate. And there’s a great chapter in McGuff’s book where he focuses on, uh, sports specific training and comparing and contrasting a workout where you’re trying to become a better athlete versus a session where you’re trying to increase muscle strength. And argument is let’s have this muscle strength effort going on in the background from whatever other athletic endeavors you’re doing. So when you’re going for strength, you do this really brutal 12 minute workout, or in the X three, you’re taking 10 minutes a day to work on the different muscles. And then I like to sprint high jump, play, speed golf. I wanna work on my skills, tennis player, basketball, whatever.

Brad (00:27:30):
Uh, but you don’t wanna really mix the, um, the effort to get stronger while you’re also playing sports because it’s too stressful to the body. And so when I’m out there sprinting, I’m practicing sprinting. My workout doesn’t last that long because I get too tired. And the ballistic, you know, jumping drills for high jumping or sprinting are so strenuous and have so much breakdown that it’s really difficult for me, cuz I’m constantly getting injured or I’m getting sore muscles or things are holding me back from going out there and sprinting every day or even more than, you know, once week on a, on a proper full duration workout. Now, if I could come to these workouts with more overall muscle strength and resiliency, then I’m looking at a nice tidy package where I can practice without that risk of breakdown and, and, you know, prolong recovery free time because I’m overall stronger person. But you know, not to mix and match. And the in the skill or the sports specific training, they don’t have to be incredibly strenuous because that’s where I think we run afoul. And if you’re thinking about someone, let’s say going in the gym and working out an hour, four days a week, and they’re doing this and they’re doing that, that’s where you could kind of tempt the overtraining breakdown, burnout, illness, injury patterns that we see are so common. CrossFit is the perfect example.

Brian (00:28:58):
Yeah, I definitely agree. You definitely wanna separate the skill of a sport versus just getting strong. But you know, you’re gonna get differing opinions on, on the best way to get strong, I guess. I mean, you’re still gonna have the traditionalists say you should, you know, you should do three sets of, you know, eight to 12 reps. But I don’t think there’s nothing that really disputes the fact that you should also really focus a lot on a negative portion of the, of the lift, which I never used to do. And you’ll see guys do this now more and more where, you know, you’re, you’re not only lifting it, let’s say on a five count on the way up, but a five count on the way down. That can make, that can go a long way. And just to, you know, just to let you know, I tried, you know, like, I, I know I’ve posted some stuff about me doing the orange band and the orange and the white band, and yes, I can do it when I’m moving at a decent pace. But let me just say yesterday, I tried it like five down and five up and like, I mean, yeah, not definitely wasn’t pretty. It wasn’t Instagram worthy.

Brad (00:30:08):
So people, if you’re familiar with the X three bar, it’s a home fitness sensation and it has a bar that you strap on these different resistance bands of varying thickness. And it comes with the nice set of four or five bands going from dark black to light gray being easy. And then if you’re a real superstar, you can order up separately, this ridiculous orange band that Dr. Jaquish shows. He’s doing his chest press and he’s a very strong guy and he’s able to use this accessory item. And then here’s Brian on Instagram doing squats. One-legged squats. Am I not mistaken there?

Brian (00:30:47):
Yeah. Yeah.

Brad (00:30:47):
So that, that is like, it’s probably the single most difficult exercise I I’ve ever tried where you don’t know that type of muscle fatigue, unless you’ve tried the variable resistance to complete muscular failure. But yeah, it’s lot of effort to stretch those bands. And I think it, it scales for everybody, which is cool too.

Brian (00:31:09):
Yeah, no, I mean, you know, we could, you know, variable resistance was something I never really talked about or did other than over the past year and a half, two years, you know, with the quarantine and then I wanted to try something different. So if you haven’t done variable, resistance is whatever it is, whether it’s the X three or whatever bands you’re trying, or, um, I think it makes sense because everyone’s on a strength curve. I mean, we’re strong at different ranges of motion. And, um, and that’s what sort of, that’s the, that’s what touts the X three as effective is the fact that when you get stronger, it gets more difficult. But yeah, all I have to say is when you slow things down, good luck. You got, I, I think I even read in Dr. Doug’s book that you should go at least 20, 30% may. It might have not been his book, but I remember reading about you should go at least 20 to 30% less weight if you’re really gonna focus on the negative and the eccentric and slowing it down. So I might have to go a little bit lighter.

Brad (00:32:10):
Oh my gosh. My first exposure to this was actually in Chicago, ‘hood. And they had the, the super slow gym. They sponsored an event Mark Sisson and I came in. Oh yeah. So they called this super slow training and everything is, you know, in this really prolonged count where you’re doing a rep of something. And so I was just meeting these people for the first time and talking about how, you know, my routine in the park is I do a hundred decline Spiderman pushups most, every morning where I’m going in sets of 40, 20, 20, 10, whatever. And I showed them, you know, you elevate your legs and you go down, not just doing an elevated pushup, but you’re driving your knee to your elbow as you lower, and then back up. And I call it the most difficult pushup there is.

Brad (00:32:55):
And they say, have you ever tried super slow? And I said, no, oh, what do I do? Okay. So I’m there with these people watching. And I lower down with their count. They’re asking me to go down for a count of eight and up for count of 10 or something. And I got to five pushups and I was completely twitching and wobbling and then dropped to the ground, collapsed in shame with all these people going, oh, you did me five, what were you saying? You do a hundred every day. So it wasn’t like incompetent at pushups, but it was so different. And then the next morning I woke up and my pecs were all sore because it was such an amazing stimulation.

Brian (00:33:34):
Yeah. It’s something, something you try to try. If you’ve never done it, just slow it down and see what you can do. You, I would definitely recommend going less weight, just feeling it out. So

Brad (00:33:44):
It’s safer too. I think it, it’s great to, you know, incorporate more people into this critical obligation of strength training. But you see a lot of times the female population. They’re going in the gym and they’re climbing the StairMaster, they’re doing the spin class, they’re doing the, you know, the strenuous cardio class, but they’re not putting their body under huge resistance load just because they’re adverse to it or intimidated. Or there is a safety factor when you’re talking about free weights that, you know, most people probably don’t need to venture in there for a long time. But when you’re doing everything slow, it’s super challenging and it’s vastly safer than, you know, hoisting even, even the machines you can, uh, strain your neck or something, if you don’t know what you’re doing when you’re hoisting weight and, and, you know, having it drop under force.

Brian (00:34:31):
Yeah. No, I, I, yeah. Um, I mean, I just did traditional lifts forever and it’s, it’s a game changer,. I’m excited. I’m excited to keep working at it. Cuz let me tell you, I’m gonna have to, yeah, I’m gonna have to go down and wait a little bit, you know, doing these, you know, like you said, eight sec, you count to eight seconds. It feels it’s like torture and then coming back. I know Jay Vincent I’ve been watching some of his videos on YouTube would help put someone through that workout. So definitely worth checking it out.

Brad (00:35:01):
So back to this idea, you said you had a, a difference of opinion coming through with your associate and talking about the once per week. You know, the Doug McGuff template is doing these five, the big five workouts, which are functional, full body exercises: leg, press, overhead, press, chest, press, seated row and pull down. Right? Okay. So these are, uh, major movements that incorporate the big muscles and you do them to total failure. One set each only. We’re doing them slowly though. So they’re, they’re pretty tough. And then you’re out of the gym probably in 12 minutes and then according to research and their whole argument is that if you try to do it more frequently than that, you won’t progress as quickly, you’ll be having delayed recovery. And so they discovered that once a week is a sweet spot and boy, it it’s, it’s tough to embrace.

Brad (00:35:59):
But the one thing I will float out there before I get your lengthy opinion is if you’re not that strong to begin with, you can probably go out there and do the workout twice because it’s not so impressive what you just did in that 12 minutes. And I’m putting myself in that category, cuz when I started doing the big five, I’m like, dang, my muscles have gone to complete failure, but I haven’t, you know, I haven’t rowed that much weight because I’m just not that strong out of the gate. And I feel like in three or four days I could probably go in there and put in an impressive effort. But I could imagine someone who is really strong and is working with 210 pounds or whatever it is, those muscles are gonna need a lot of repair time.

Brian (00:36:44):
Yeah. I mean, I think it’s, it depends, it probably depends on your background, how much you’ve been lifting. I mean, once a week, to me just sounds like, um, you would need to stimulate, you need to get more stimuli more than once a week, but again, you know, he’s obviously has a lot of research behind this. My only thing with his big five is I’m just surprised. There’s not some type of hip hinge in there. You know, some type of deadlift motion. You know, obviously leg press plays an important role, but you know, that’s the only thing I would say. But yeah, I mean we can probably talk hours about, you know, this or that. I think if you’re not doing anything, once a week is great and you know, what, if it gets you, if it, if it gets you moving and, and, and, and you know, something that you’ve never done before I would go for it, if you’ve never done resistance training, then you know, definitely I would say start with once a week. I think it just depends how, how you’re stimulating, how, how you’re stimulating the model and you know, I think you need someone, I think, you know, like Dr. Doug McGuff, he’s really, they’re really getting it to fatigue. And I think everyone’s a little bit different. Some people might re recover faster than others. So,

Brad (00:37:52):
It’s also, um, Dr. John Jaquish with OsteoStrong that that chain of centers that are, are designed targeting the osteoporosis, the senior population and trying to rebuild, not just muscle strength, but bone density. They’re also on this once a week protocol. And look, if you’re going in there and you’re putting up bigger numbers week after week after week, something’s working and we’re not talking about, you know, my mom just joined OsteoStrong in Los Angeles. And, uh, she’s gone through several sessions and is showing that she’s stronger on the chess press by this many percent. Look, we’re not going for the Olympics here where we wanna sneak in another workout on the Friday after your Tuesday to see if you can get some marginal gains. And I think that’s where a lot of us get tripped up is especially like I’m familiar with the endurance community and the triathletes who are super competitive and driven and want to get a little faster in the swim and also improve their hill climbing on their bike.

Brad (00:38:49):
And they go out there and they overdo it and they push into hormone imbalance, fatigue, muscle breakdown, things like that, because they’re going for incremental gains rather than a patient and perhaps a conservative approach. But again, if you’re putting up a bigger number, I don’t think you’re gonna be in the risk of de-training. When you go and do that impressive workout once a week. Sisson likes to tell this anecdote of his, a college girlfriend. So we’re talking about decades ago, right? He’s, he’s an old man now come on people. He is, this is maybe 50 years ago now. Uh, and he said his girlfriend would go to the gym once a month and do a very, very difficult workout where she wanted to put up this many plates on the machines and then she’d do whatever the rope climb or something that you measure.

Brad (00:39:38):
And if she could complete the workout at the same standard she met the previous month. She was good to go and she was maintaining her fitness and whatever she did in between that maybe she lived a healthy, active lifestyle. She’s hiking, she’s going for a roller skating date with Mark Sisson. Who knows. But that was pretty interesting to think, 50 years ago, here’s someone who’s thinking so sensibly. And so, you know, it, it’s irrefutable logic that if you can, you know, stay in shape by meeting the same workout standard over time. And geez, let’s open up my training logs over my time as a serious athlete, I’d have horrible month here and three week lull here because I got burnt out, broken down, I got injured, I lost all my fitness. I had to climb back up. None of that was happening with the smooth gracefulness of someone who’s going once a month and putting up numbers. Yeah,

Brian (00:40:29):
That’s a great point. I mean, if you’re, I guess it all comes down to results. Right? And I think that was talked about in Doug McGuff’s book is the fact that they found that they were getting better results by doing you know, a once a week protocol of just really intense time under tension exercise. And they said, well, that’s, you know, that, that shows that you, you might only need, you know, whatever, five to seven days of rest, well, uh, which is quite a think quite a bit for a traditional lifter. I mean, it all comes down to results, right? I mean, Hey, um, I just think I, I enjoy working out. I enjoy doing, you know, I, I, I just enjoy doing that. So it just, for me, I’m like, well, what else am I, you know, it’s like golf.

Brian (00:41:13):
Like, you know what else, you know, we don’t have golf now in the winter here. So now, you know, I spent a little more time in the gym and, you know, I could do stuff other things that are more skill based, you know, whether it’s balance or, or working on different ranges of motion, um, you know, with squats and, you know like a lateral plane or, you know, you could do a lot of different things that don’t necessarily simply focus on muscle building, which I think is, you know, obviously can be beneficial in general just for range, emotion and mobility.

Brad (00:41:44):
Right, right. And I’m thinking the interesting insight that’s really, uh, changed my approach in recent times is to reflect on the training patterns of the, the great elite athletes of the planet. And these people are so supremely conditioned that when they go out there to their two hour training session every single day, and they’re, if you watch from the stands, they’re doing some impressive, hard work there , but they’re so highly conditioned. And they’re so genetically gifted too. Let’s not forget that, that these workouts are not as taxing as the average CrossFit person who’s trying to go show up four days a week because of the sense of community and the wonderful socializing, but they’re putting themselves through hell four days a week because climbing a rope three times and running around the block hundred meters, and then coming back and doing some Olympic liftings is truly strenuous.

Brad (00:42:38):
And so this is the pattern that we wanna be on high alert for is that fatiguing, exhausting training pattern. But then we kind of misinterpret the example that the elites are setting. Uh, the runners are famous for this, where they’re looking at, um, you know, the, the Olympic marathon runners like Galen Rubb or.

Brian (00:42:56):
eluid Kipchoge, or Moe Farah, and they can show their training on the internet and watch the videos of them doing six times, a thousand meters with a 30 second recovery. And they’re hitting about two minutes, 47 for each one. It’s like, wow, those guys are working so hard, but they’re so supremely conditioned. It is, many of their workouts are literally comparable to the average endurance athlete, taking a brisk walk around the block with the dog. And so if we can reframe our training goals to where, Hey, Brian likes going out, going to the gym. He’s popular there. Everyone says, hi, he talks, he gets over and does his workout.

Brad (00:43:33):
But if you were to, let’s say, cut your weight down to, you know, 60% of one red max or whatever you’re doing. Hey, you’re breathing, you’re getting a little sweat. Uh, you’re working on the balance. Things like you talked about, you’re doing these peripheral activities, but you walk outta that gym and you’re nowhere near fatigued, exhausted, or depleted. You’ve just worked hard to kind of, uh, you know, maintain a fitness base and a launching platform from the times where you really are gonna go hit it hard. And I don’t think that should be more than once a week for almost everyone, especially those listening. The Olympic athletes might be out there doing two epic workouts a week, but that’s because they’re Olympic athletes.

Brian (00:44:16):
Yeah, no, it’s a good point. And, um, you know, I’m looking in your background here. You say your Two Meals a Day book, and I’m just curious, what, what did you, what did you learn from doing that book? And, um, and how do you think, you know, I don’t know. I mean, obviously there’s more than you talk about more than just two meals a day, but what are the, some of, some of the big pillars that you learned from that?

Brad (00:44:37):
Oh, thanks. Yeah, that’s a good transition. Cause I think we should talk about how the diet component comes in and the fasting and getting lean and all that. Um, and, uh, just to say goodbye to the, the exercise example for a moment. One way to screw up your fat reduction goals and your healthy eating and living goals is that over exercising pattern where you become carbohydrate dependent, because you’re trying to refuel from these overly stressful workouts, not to pick on CrossFit. I keep using that example, but if you’re going and blasting yourself with a extremely challenging workout, four days a week, you’re gonna be eating 3, 4, 5 or six meals a day because you’re gonna be in this ravenous state where your glycogen depleted, your brain, your appetite hormones are all screwed up because of, of the overly stressful nature of your workouts. So, um, I think we do a pretty hard effort in the book to talk about the lifestyle factors that influence your dietary goals, your dietary transformation goals.

Brad (00:45:36):
So we gotta get that stuff dialed before we go tweaking around with our diet. I mean, ketos been so popular for years and we have, uh, several books on that, on that subject. But when you’re talking about slashing your carbohydrate intake, you need to regulate your life stress levels. Because as we know, uh, that, you know, high cortisol production, high fight or flight response, prolonged fight or flight response is directly correlated with increased appetite for quick energy carbohydrate. So you’re running around with a hectic daily pace. That behavior is largely going to be fueled by junk food and energy carbs that, that give you that boost that you need, because you’re constantly going on fight or flight, where if you sit down to, pleasant, enjoyable meals, you’re eating nutritious foods, uh, you’re kind of promoting that fat burning state, which is that stress rests balance. And so those go hand in hand, before we even talk about, you know, cutting out the Ben and Jerry’s habit in the evening, we gotta unwind that story of why that spoon needed to go into that pint of ice cream, 23 times to kill the pint. It’s likely driven by overly stressful lifestyle habits.

Brian (00:46:48):
Yeah. I mean, you bring up a lot of good points. I’m looking also behind your right shoulder. Well, yes, it’s your right shoulder and your Carnivore Nutrient Dense Chart, right? The Carnivore Scores. And I, I love that. It’s actually something that I refer to quite a bit. And one of the things I think I liked the most that you sort of led me on to was the SMASH family, because sardines, mackerel, anchovies, salmon, and herring. I like the fact that I think that sometimes people think that if they’re going to eat really healthy, it’s gonna be really expensive. And taking that excuse out, because I will say I’ve been buying herring. It’s like my new thing. Herring and actually mackerel and combining them, which you wouldn’t think, oh, but maclerel’s very like a neutral flavor, so you could probably put it with anything.

Brian (00:47:41):
But that’s been like my, you know, I typically have two meals a day, sometimes one sometimes, you know, sometimes, maybe little bit more, just depends on the day, but for, for on average, probably two meals a day. And that first meal used to be a big salad and, um, like a veggie burger. I mean, I was like, I, I was not a, this was like two years ago. I was not a meat eater. I was like a pescatarian for a while. And I used to find the, I choose to try to find very high quality veggie burgers without a lot of vegetables. Cause I know there’s a lot that do have a lot of junk in ’em, but I found some good ones and either way it was still weighing me down. But now and this is just me personally. Um, I went into the smash family and I used that as my middle of the day. Let’s just say two o’clock first meal. Um, and been combining Herring in mackerel and sometimes sardines, I tried anchovies and I’ve had ’em before. I don’t know. I just can’t can’t really do that, but I just love that family right there. The wild caught cold water fish, because they’re not overly expensive and you know, they can be any, you know, it’s, they’re easy to get and they’re not overly expensive, I guess is my point.

Brad (00:48:53):
Always highlight the budget aspect, because you hear so much blow back from people saying, well you know, all that organic stuff is more expensive. Grass fed is hideously expensive. I’m even scared to buy the you know, you, you see the beautiful steaks from Belcampo, the fancy market in Los Angeles and it’s $34. And I’m like, you know what, I’m not that good enough of a cook to buy that thing and go home and screw it up. So I’m kind of scared. But if you look at the chart that Kate Cretsinger and I developed, liver grassed liver is arguably the most nutrient dense food on the planet. And it’s dirt cheap because people are the consumer demand is not there. And so if you look at the high rankings, the SMASH family, the pasture raised eggs, where you’re paying six bucks or something for a dozen instead of three bucks, that is the best return on investment value for the increase in nutrient density from getting a true pastured egg.

Brad (00:49:53):
And now they’re in widespread distribution all over the country, especially Vital Farms. You see them I think they have a consortium of local farms. And so you can get that product almost anywhere and anything you can’t get, you can go and order online. I have Butcher Box delivering food to my door. It’s all grass fed and pasture raised, US Wellness Meats has, uh, these beautiful cuts of all the different organs, heart, liver, kidney, liverwurst, braunschweiger. Very, very affordable. So all of a sudden you’re eating at the very highest level of nutrient density and it does not have a huge budget impact. And so if we can put that excuse aside for a moment, then we’re looking good. And of course you can go get some delicacies. I mean, salmon eggs are also highly ranked up there with liver.

Brad (00:50:38):
And you can get a very small amount of salmon eggs for $10. So I’m not, uh, doing that as much as I’m doing the liver but whatever, or it takes, uh, there’s ways to make it work. And I think the great experience of coming away from, uh, preparing that chart was to realize that, you know, this has now become my main dietary focus is to elevate the nutrient density of my diet more so than, you know, worrying about macronutrient ratios, even having a ton of variety, like, you know, we have enough pleasures and indulgences in life and I go out and get enough you know, wonderful restaurant meals or special meals when we’re on vacation. I have enough of that to last me and sustain me. So when I’m home, I have no problem just cooking up the same or very similar things day after day after day.

Brad (00:51:29):
Because I think of food as you know, it’s not just for pleasure and indulgence. It’s also medicine. It’s also fuel. It’s also the, maybe the number one health intervention you can make to promote longevity and avoid disease, risk factors. So it’s kind of you know, it’s easy to make those decision to say, look, I’m gonna sit down and have something that I happen to enjoy, but I don’t have to go outta my way to constantly please my pal and get this incredible variety and then temp, you know, bring the temptations in of the indulgent foods, the decadent foods that, you know, lend themselves to being consumed more and more because the, uh, literally addictive to the brain and the appetite receptors.

Brian (00:52:12):
Yeah. I mean, you talk about, you know, spending this on a budget too. What about like ground meat?Ground meat is less expensive than going out and buying a rib eye. And I use a company called there’s there’s other ones, but Force of Nature, I, I order their ground. Yeah. They’re ground ancestral blend. And it’s also has, I believe they put, um, some organs in there as well. I believe heart and one other organ is already blended up in there. So it’s great. You don’t even know it’s there if you’re worried about, oh, I don’t want to have heart or I don’t wanna have liver cuz it’s, maybe you’re worried about the taste. Well, get a ground meat where it’s already grounded in there. You won’t even know it’s there and you’re eating high nutrient dense foods for not that expensive.

Brian (00:52:56):
I think one package is like 11 bucks and that’s probably, I think, you know, last, at least one or two, at least two meals, I would say on that, maybe one for some people. Like I said, I, I that’s the key, I mean, right. I mean, we can talk to we’re blue in the face about working out and how many sets and how many reps and intensity. I mean, if you’re going for walks and you’re eating quality, nutrient dense foods, I mean that, that right. That right there can make, can go a long way.

Brad (00:53:25):
Yeah. And back to the title of the book Two Meals a Day. That was the other big insight that we tried to highlight was there’s two, uh, deals, it, it, in play here. One of them is the choices that you make of the foods that you eat and trying, you know, to go for the more helpful products. But there’s this other element of how frequently we eat. And that’s the part that seems to have been widely abused in modern times. Uh, there’s also great research in recent years, about time restricted feeding the importance of giving the body. You know, the digestive circadian rhythm goes hand in hand with our overall a circadian rhythm. So we don’t want to be eating much at all after dark. We don’t wanna be eating throughout our waking hours. Dr. Panda’s research at Salk Institute, UC San Diego.

Brad (00:54:16):
I think he had like an average food eating window for the large population that participated in his study. The average was like 16 point something hours. And it’s like, wait a second. That’s how long we’re awake. Yeah. And so for, for many, many people, they put calories in their mouth, as soon as they awaken and they’re nibbling on something all the way up until right before they go to bed. So now it’s become popular to kind of compress that eating window into whatever number of hours. And I’ll ask your opinion on some of that stuff going on. I know you’re, um, you’re big on those tightened eating windows. Uh, but I think generally, um, there’s a lot of personal preference here that we need to respect and whatever works for people. But just the idea that we can sustain ourselves without these regular feedings and snacks, especially can be really harmful to fat loss goals. That’s a nice completely different journey to travel besides making the good choices when we do eat.

Brian (00:55:17):
You bring up snacking. Actually. I had Megan Ramos on my podcast over the past year, and Megan Ramos has partnered with, uh, Dr. Jason Fung, who was probably the first author and doctor that I read about talking about fasting. And, um, I read his first book, Obesity Code, and that really spurred me into this sort of journey down intermittent fasting. And so I completely agree. I think that, I always say the first place to start is, well, if you don’t want two meals a day and you wanna do three meals a day, that’s fine. Just eliminate snacking. And she actually, I asked her at the end of the, the interview, I said, well, what, what do you think would be one beneficial tip for individuals, you know, if they wanna, you know, maybe, maybe get their bodies back to what it once was 10, 15 years ago,? Which is a question I ask a lot of my guests and she’s like, you know, she, and she, she’s seen so many different clients do with fasting.

Brian (00:56:10):
She’s like, you know, if they could just eliminate snacking, um, right there that tip alone can go, you know, go a long way. And like you talk about it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s a combination of these foods that are stimulating insulin, all, you know, um, but also doing it frequently throughout the day. It’s, you know, so if you can, you know, yeah. If you’re gonna have foods, obviously any, food’s gonna stimulate insulin for the most part, some more than others, obviously. Right. But if you can just reduce that number to maybe two meals a day or three meals a day, and, and that’s it, that’s a great place to start, even if you don’t wanting to get into, um, some type of window of fasting.

Brad (00:56:51):
Yeah. There’s some good commentary about this feast or famine concept. I think Dr. Art DeVany was the first one to really harp on that where, you know, we’re, we’re designed to we’re designed to live well off of stored energy and perhaps the healthiest way to go through life is this, this feast or famine pattern that we’ve experienced throughout evolution. And I know in my own personal example, like once I turn that switch on, like I haven’t eaten yet today, it’s around midday here on the west coast. As soon as I do, I’m gonna go probably have what would be considered a large meal because it’s time to eat and I’m gonna enjoy it. I’m not gonna limit my portion sizes or any of that nonsense that we know is kind of dated and, and flawed guidance. But, I also, wasn’t obsessed with food in the early morning awaking hours because I’m good at burning fat and I’m not worried about it. I’m busy. I was doing things. But it’s kind of, I, I think if you’re leaking in snacks throughout the day, that could disturb your, your appetite and your, your caloric intake because you kind of a snack begets additional snacking and transitioning right into a meal. And if that’s your pattern in your habit, it’s gonna be easy to kind of disregulate.

Brian (00:58:12):
Yeah. And one thing I found just working with clients is I think if you keep it simple and it’s like a black and white thing, people will follow it. So that’s where I think fasting can come and play a big role in the sense that you’re either not either you either not eating or you, or, you know, you’re either in a fed state or you’re in a fasted state. Now, granted, yes. There’s a little maybe ambiguity and there’s a gray area. Oh, can I have black coffee or can I have tea? And yeah, I mean, I would say that at anything with calories is breaking a fast, right. So, um,

Brad (00:58:49):
Wow. Imagine that people, Brian is using the literal definition of the term rather than all this nonsense about our brown rice fast. Like what is that? It doesn’t make sense. Fasting means not eating right. And I’m also on a campaign. I don’t know if you know this, but, uh, I’m on a quest to eliminate the term intermittent fasting and just call it fasting because intermittent fasting is, right? It’s a redundant phrase, right? Of course it’s intermittent fasting. We’re not fasting. I mean, we’re fasting or we’re eating. So, uh, it’s always intermittent fasting, even if it’s an hour. So come on, just call it fasting. Okay. That’s my, that’s my soapbox.

Brian (00:59:27):
Yeah, no, that’s okay. That’s yeah. Well, it’s funny cuz I, I, uh, I was in Florida, uh, a couple weeks ago and I go on the driving range and this guy who I’ve known for a while and he’s pretty healthy. He goes, are you still into that fasting thing? And I go, you mean not eating? You know, it’s like, I think people, they hear that word and it’s like, oh my God, like the like dooms day is coming. And I, you know, and I, I’m not gonna blame them cuz honestly, when I first was learning about fasting, which I did through a client of mine. She actually introduced me to it cuz she was, she was overweight and pre-diabetic and she just got into it on her, on her own and started doing fasting and the extent of, and got all her blood numbers back to normal.

Brian (01:00:11):
And I just thought it was unbelievable. And so anyways, that’s, that was my story into fasting. But um, yeah, I, I think that people, there’s this kind connotation around fasting that they’re scared of it or, or that, that what’s gonna happen if they have hunger pains. I think that’s the biggest thing. And, and, and once you wrap your arms around that and you accept this, this hunger that’s gonna come, but it will also go. Like hunger, hunger cues come and they go, and they’re usually based on certain times of the day where to eating. So I think it’s important to, I think I like mixing up when I’m eating and keeping my body sort of guessing and metabolically flexible in the sense that it doesn’t really know when I’m gonna eat. You know, there’s sometimes where I might eat earlier and there’s sometimes where I might not eat till later. So I think messing around with that and just getting at, I know some people like to keep to as schedule, but I think actually for your body and just for your mind, and, and if you’re getting the fasting to, to change up your eating pattern a little bit, just so you’re not so stuck in one way.

Brad (01:01:13):
Yeah. I like that. It’s not being attached or addicted to anything, even in a positive manner where you’re a keto person and it’s become part of your identity and you never eat more than 50 grams of carbs a day. And you’re very rigid about that. And if there’s nothing to eat there in your, in your environment, you’re going skip the meal or you’re gonna stress out. You’re gonna have to reach for one of your especially approved keto snacks. And that makes you having a little bit more of a rigid lifestyle. So I think that term metabolic flexibility like you describe, Hey, I’m sometimes gonna have a, a massive giant breakfast if we’re going out and it’s a social event and I feel like it, I’m gonna hit it. And then the next day I might not eat anything till 1:00 PM.

Brad (01:02:01):
And all those things possibly could be, uh, described as the, the, the healthiest and most well adjusted way to eat because when you get that regimentation restriction and narrow focus, um, this can easily lead to, uh, symptoms of orthorexia. That’s an unhealthy fixation on the correct approach. And that is a prominent, uh, and increasing problem, especially in the progressive health community where people are learning more and more. Now I’m not going to say, uh, follow this up with a quip like everything in moderation that really bugs me when people use that comment when it comes to diet because our diet is so disastrous in our overall health state here. We’re both in America, you know, the richest nation in the history of humanity, but it also has the sickest and fattest population that’s ever been recorded on the, the face of the earth.

Brad (01:03:00):
And so when you say everything in moderation, we’re talking about dealing with an average that is so pathetic that we need to strive to be extreme in our pursuit of healthy eating practices and healthy living standards because moderation means that we’re allowing all these toxic chemical-laden, endocrine disrupting, you know, appetite-disturbing foods because that’s the average in the norm. So I’m, I’m not big on, um, you know, a, a casual approach and allowing, for example, the refined industrial seed oils to linger around. And there’s some examples here in your cupboard, in your fridge. I think we should have an extreme approach to eradicate our diet of the toxic chemicals that are associated with cancer and disease. But then in that big picture, Hey, yeah, you can fluctuate your meal times if you’re gonna enjoy an indulgent or a treat once in a while, let’s have it be the most exquisitely chosen and selected…. Oh, Brian, if you’re watching on video, he’s putting up, he’s putting up a jar of Brad’s, Macadamia Masterpiece it literally right there on the screen.

Brian (01:04:07):
It literally came and I’m not kidding you five minutes before we started here.

Brad (01:04:10):
He opened the box and then turned on the mic.

Brian (01:04:14):
We’re meant to be talking right now because it came right before. Yeah.

Brad (01:04:18):
And, you know, I mentioned going on vacation to Seattle where they have the handmade ice cream shops and people stand in line in the, in the nice summer evening, and you go and get this, this wonderful handmade ice cream. And I will indulge, um, you know, gleefully every time I’m in Seattle, but that’s not the same as having a pint of this ice cream on my shopping list and stalking and restocking for the other, uh, 11 and a half months a year. So if we can be like more mindful and deliberate with our celebratory choices, that is, you know, going hand in hand with leading a healthy, balanced lifestyle.

Brian (01:04:55):
Yeah. And you bring up something, two points, one cooking for yourself, I think can go a long way. I had Dr. Bill Schindler, Dr. Bill Schindler on my podcast. He just came out with a book. But check out his work. I mean, he, they make everything and they also, which I’ve never done, I’ve never hunted or done stuff like that. I don’t know if I would, but he, he really, he really stresses how, you know, that, how important that is and, um, just working for your food and as opposed to just always ordering on Uber eats and

Brad (01:05:29):
Love it, love it. Yeah. Sitting down and preparing a meal, chopping up the, the onions.

Brian (01:05:34):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then, um, I gotta lost my train of thought, but that was but, but oh no, that, and I think a big thing that I find that works with a lot of clients too, is you, you know, you gotta clean out the cupboard, right? You gotta, you gotta, if your habits keep fighting you and you find yourself wandering into the kitchen, well, take out all those temptations by just not having anything in there that would be that, that you would want. If you don’t wanna throw it away, give it away, bring it to work. We always bring our sweets or whatever, right? To work. So other people, obviously, that’s not like a greatest thing, but other people, other people will have it not you. Um, but that’s the biggest thing my wife and I do is we just, we buy, we order stuff that we freeze in the freezer, places like Force of Nature, different meats and fishes that we like.

Brian (01:06:31):
I tried this place called Zootopia, which I learned from another podcast and bay are California real, really cool fishes. If you wanna get some high end, like sushi grade fish. But you know, try those, put those in the freezer, be prepared that way and take all the temptation out by not buying you know, those things that are gonna get in your way, you know the ice creams and you can have your, you can have sort of your temptation foods, but have them maybe be on a lower scale. You know, like my Macadamia Masterpiece, I, I do love nuts and I’m not sensitive to them, so I don’t mind having them here and there. And, and I put this on like an, an egg white wrap. I used to love peanut butter and jelly, but I put this on like an egg white wrap, which is like literally made up of nothing of just, and with this in like a little bit of like guava jelly.

Brian (01:07:26):
And it’s like, it’s yes. Is it a normal peanut butter and jelly that I would get with a normal piece of white bread that I had probably when I was 10 years old? No, it’s not the same. But for me, it actually is. It meets my requirement and that’s my splurging. So I think if you can find your level of splurge and maybe just dial it up a little bit and make it, so it’s a little more refined and better not refined, meaning, meaning refined, but like just, yeah, you get my point, I think,

Brad (01:07:53):
Yeah. I love it. I love it. And it’s important to highlight that environment is like everything, right? If you create that healthy environment in your house, and also I think your peer group and the people you, uh, you surround yourself with if we all allow these indulgences and lack of discipline, that’s kind of where we’re gonna head. And then when we get into the mix with people who really care, and maybe you’re gonna be the one setting, the shining example, and other people are gonna be following along, maybe reluctantly at first, but at least you’re walking your talk and you’re not kind of an enabler. I think we, we, we do that to other in a negative aspect really easily where, you know, one person gives permission. The Framingham Study has that interesting pull out insights about obesity clusters.

Brad (01:08:46):
I don’t know if you’ve, they found happiness clusters. They found obesity clusters. Interesting. And this degrees of separation where I think the obesity clusters were going in three degrees of separation. So if you, and let’s say your neighbors are obese, there’s a high likelihood that it’s, uh, contagious. And, uh, to the extent that, uh, your friends and your friends, friends are all showing adverse health markers and disease risk factors, because you, you hang around together and kind of you know, emanate that type of energy versus, you know, people who are wandering around the gym every day and all their friends are Jim goers and members of the running group. And sort of that type of behavior is contagious also.

Brian (01:09:34):
Yeah. I mean, you see this with parents and their kids, it’s sort of this sad sometimes, right. Same type of thing. But yeah, no, I mean, surrounding yourself with the, with, you know, I always say. Like I coach golf, for high schoolers and, and I meet with them at the end of the year. We do a one-on-one meeting and, and the seniors. I’m always trying to think of something that I could, you know, it’s a couple good words for them as they’re going off to college. And one of the things that I tell them is surround yourself with the right type of people and the habits that you want to get into. Cuz you see that a lot people surround themselves with the wrong individuals or they’re doing the wrong habits, uh, especially going into college. And if you could find yourself, I had a few friends that were into lifting and into, I was into Motai kickboxing and we used to go to these, you know, gyms on our up in Indianapolis cuz I was at Butler for a couple years. And yeah, I mean that’s, it’s so key it, I mean there’s nothing, there’s nothing better than surrounding yourself with people that have healthy habits. That’s for sure.

Brad (01:10:40):
Love it, man. We’ve had a wide ranging conversation here. I know cutting across fitness, diet, health, lifestyle, making good choices as a college student,

Brian (01:10:49):
We can keep going. Maybe we’ll do part two. Maybe we’ll do part

Brad (01:10:52):
Two. We’ll do part two. We’ll get some Q and A teed up. That’s always nice to hear from. Um, so you know, if you’re listening to the, the show, you have some different topic, suggestions, ideas, email either one of us, you can, you can talk to me at podcast@bradventures.com and I had had a great time.

Brian (01:11:10):
Yeah. Brian at Brian Gryn.com. That’s easy. And, and yeah, we could keep going on this. So maybe we’ll do, I mentioned to Brad, maybe like an Instagram live. Q and A too. Maybe we can dial one of those up. I did that with Dr. Ted Naiman and I thought that went really well. So

Brad (01:11:24):
Love it. Thanks everybody for joining me with Brian Gryn,, Get clean, Eat clean. There you go. Do it all. Do

Brian (01:11:31):
Where’s the music. I wanna hear the music.

Brad (01:11:39):
Thank you for listening to the show. I love sharing the experience with you and greatly appreciate your support. Please. Email podcast@Bradventures.com with feedback suggestions and quest for the Q and A shows. Subscribe to our email list to Brad kearns.com for a weekly blast about the published episodes and a wonderful bi-monthly newsletter edition with informative articles and practical tips for all aspects of healthy living. You can also download several awesome free eBooks when you subscribe to the email list. And if you could go to the trouble to leave a five or five star review with apple podcast or wherever else you listen to the shows that would be super, incredibly awesome. It helps raise the profile of the B.rad podcast and attract new listeners. And did you know that you can share a show with a friend or loved one by just hitting a few buttons in your or player and firing off a text message? My awesome podcast player called Overcast allows you to actually record a sound bite excerpt from the episode you’re listening to and fire it off with a quick text message. Thank you so much for spreading the word and remember B.rad.




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