Enjoy this wide-ranging and deep conversation with international fitness celebrity, supermodel, and former professional beach volleyball player, Gabrielle Reece.

Gabby is a former women’s beach volleyball star, television host, supermodel, fitness expert, and author, columnist, and podcast host. She was named one of the “20 Most Influential Women in Sports,” by Women’s Sports and Fitness, and one of the top five most beautiful women in the world by Elle magazine.  Gabby and her husband Laird Hamilton have been celebrated as America’s fittest couple and have spent many years in the public eye as innovative fitness leaders.  

What Gabby is perhaps most appreciated for is being the real deal – a breath of fresh air in the celebrity world of manufactured image and branding. While lunching with my main man Mark Sisson in Malibu, I have enjoyed meeting Gabby and Laird on a few occasions over the years. What struck me each time was how open and authentic and fun-loving Gabby is in real life. We chatted only briefly, but she offered up some deep reflections about athletes dealing with injuries and adjusting competitive goals over time and dealing with hectic modern life and her various roles of mother, celebrity, athlete, and coach.  

After our first meeting, I was drawn to Gabby’s 2013 book titled, My Foot Is Too Big For the Glass Slipper: A Guide To A Less Than Perfect LifeShe was raw, vulnerable, very funny, and very thoughtful. The book description sets the tone nicely: “With hilarious stories, wise insights, and concrete takeaways on topics ranging from navigating relationship issues to aging gracefully to getting smart about food, My Foot Is Too Big for the Glass Slipper  is the brutally honest, wickedly funny, and deeply helpful portrait of the humor, grace, and humility it takes to survive the happily ever after. 

I think you will absolutely love this interview with a peak performer who knows how to enjoy life, strive to keep things in balance, not take herself too seriously, and especially become a better person every day!


Gabby is a very accomplished woman and well known in her field. She talks about finding a balance between fame and her real self. [09:33]

Does Gabby’s 6’3” height affect how she thinks she’s perceived? [13:52]

Once we forgo living up to others’ expectations, it is liberating. [16:09]

How do you parent your kids to deal with having such well-known parents with well-known friends?  [18:18]

Kids need to learn to navigate this world on their own. [22:26]

People need a place to express themselves…who they are. [26:04]

Gabby’s background wasn’t free and easy and she wasn’t groomed to be successful. [30:13]

It’s important to put the past behind you and move on. [32:34]

There’s a lot of beauty if life. You have to be willing to recognize it.  [37:55]

Create a system that helps you navigate life. [43:19]

When in disagreement, even if you are “right,” it is important to listen to the other person’s point. [47:16]

Think about how you can be better today and you can be in charge of that. [49:21]

If you are ‘triggered,” figure out why you are triggered. [51:39]

As a parent, it is difficult not to put your crap on the kids. [55:24]

It’s really powerful as a parent to give space to the child. [56:57]

How does fitness commitment help achieve balance your life? [1:01:23]

In a relationship, you bring both independent commitment and then nurture that in the partnership as well. [1:04:43]


My Foot is Too Big for the Glass Slipper

Byron Katie

Biology of the Subconscious

10 Questions: Gabrielle Reece


Download Episode MP3

Get Over Yourself Podcast

Brad: 00:00:08 Welcome to the get over yourself podcast. This is author and athlete, Brad Kearns, discovering ways to be healthy, fit and happy in hectic, high-stress, modern life. So let’s slow down and take a deep breath. Take a cold plunge and expertly balance that competitive intensity with an appreciation of the journey. That’s the theme of the show. Here we go.

Brad: 00:04:36 Hey listeners, what a fantastic opportunity coming up to listen to a truly remarkable, interesting breakthrough person. That is Gabby Reece. Yes, the international fitness celebrity, former pro beach volleyball star TV host Supermodel, author, columnist podcast host. She was named one of the 20 most influential women in sports by women’s sports and fitness and one of the top five most beautiful women in the world by Elle magazine and other celebrity fitness, athletic accolades and accomplishments. And you know what’s great about Gabby is that she is the real deal. She’s like a breath of fresh air here in the branded, influential celebrity culture of manufactured lives and positioning of your message. And I learned this within a few minutes of meeting her for the first time in person in Malibu. I was just introduced to her by our mutual buddy Sisson and right out of the blue.

Brad: 00:05:38 She just got into a deep intense conversation. Lasted only a few minutes as we were leaving a restaurant. But she had such thoughtful insights. It inspired me to go pick up her 2013 book titled My Foot is Too Big for the Glass Slipper, a guide to a less than perfect life. The title alludes to the fact that she’s six foot three, uh, volleyball legend, supermodel type person with a larger than life presence. And I got into this audio book and I was immediately captivated because she offered these relationship insights and storytelling with such intense honesty and authenticity and vulnerability that you don’t hear so often and always with a sense of humor and a lighthearted touch and self deprecation throughout just being real and talking about trying to live a better life. So I really think you’re going to enjoy this show. We touch on some really fun and interesting topics. How to be motivated for peak performance by gratitude rather than that old story of that drive and intensity cause you were wronged or had a difficult upbringing. Getting really good at listening, both in your partnership and especially as a parent. And we talk a lot about the topic of parenting, particularly how to guard against the modern trend of helicopter parenting. And Gabby’s big on letting her kids figure things out on their own. Maybe even having some stumbles and challenges along the way. We talk about the wisdom that you get as you get older and recalibrating your goals accordingly and then how to balance it all because she’s got so much stuff going on, but she’s chill about it. She’s grateful. And at the same time, she’s a tough, focused, intense, driven woman. She talks about having that personal accountability and getting rid of the storytelling and the excuse making. So let’s get into it with Gabby Reece. I know you’re going to enjoy this show. Aloha? Hi. Hi Gabby. How are you?

Gabby: 00:07:43 I’m great. How about you?

Brad: 00:07:46 Are you enjoying a long stay in Hawaii?

Gabby: 00:07:48 I’m actually in California at the moment. I’ll be going back on Tuesday.

Brad: 00:07:52 Uh, so you’re, uh, you’re okay in Malibu, did you guys get cleared out or what happened?

Gabby: 00:07:58 Um, Laird’s saved our house. We, um, he had gotten 10 years prior, a pump and traded two surfboards, wood for a fire suit and, um, they were all quite organized in our garage and I was always like

Brad: 00:08:16 Whatever.

Gabby: 00:08:17 And then he saved our house in a few neighbors house with the pump in our pool. So it was good though.

Brad: 00:08:23 Another story just like saying the dude at the Malibu pier when he was out in the big surf. That’s right. Oh. Oh, that’s amazing. Well, uh, I appreciate, I appreciate you joining me. I think, uh, you guys are the fresh air of the planet. I know we just had some quick meetings at Malibu, at the hangout and uh, we, we chatted for just a few minutes, but you were so, you were so real and authentic and gave some insights about parenting and athletic recovery from injury. So, um, it seems like you’re kind of known for that as being a real authentic, open, honest, vulnerable. It seems like your, your calling card, Huh?

Gabby: 00:09:06 Kind of a weird thing though, right? Cause then does that become inauthentic of, you’re known for being that way, right? Right. You have to come up with something raw and controversial to say, cause you’re so honest. Yeah. Are you just have to go away for a little bit and try to become a part of an extended version of yourself and then have something new to talk about.

Brad: 00:09:26 Go, go write some journal entries and then come out and share it with the world.

Gabby: 00:09:30 Yeah.Something like that.

Brad: 00:09:33 Did you ever feel any stress or backlash from not being a manufactured, crafted brand such as someone in your position is mostly expected to be?

Gabby: 00:09:47 You know, I think the only time that that, and I’ve, I’ve looked, you know, I’m luckily being older you like, you learn a lot of valuable lessons. Um, I mean, we all do. Hopefully that’s the hope, right?

Brad: 00:10:00 Oh my gosh, that’s, that’s going to think of benefits of getting older. I mean, honestly, you know, we’re both old time athletes. You’re not spiking the volleyball on the, in the sand anymore and getting way high over the net, but there’s gotta be something good out of it. And that’s one that you just referenced. It’s just that wisdom and that reflection. So you can act accordingly and in daily life.

Gabby: 00:10:21 Yeah. And so I think for me, um, maybe the most uncomfortable part is if you’re trying to be, um, like sincere and you aren’t guarded. And so if you’re throwing out ideas that are very personal to yourself and then people criticize that, I think that becomes, that can be tricky. I’m not, and then you start to have other things that you learn about. Um, In some ways that doesn’t have anything to do with me. Right? Like someone having a response to something I’m doing. If I’m, if I’m not being mal intended, let’s say, um, I don’t know. It’s just like you, sorry, I’m just going to move over to the light. You just, you kind of receive it as an understanding of where they’re at and not take it personal. So I think, listen, there we have to answer to ourselves. So at the end of the day, if I can answer to myself and if I can apologize when I’m wrong or identify that as often as I can, we blow that too. Um, and I feel like, you know, I have Laird’s respect. I think I, I think that that ends up being the most powerful thing. And then you sort of take the gamble of people criticizing you because they will anyway, whether I’m doing something that’s super slick and glossy or being who I am, it’s like there’s always gonna be that that’s just part of, it’s sort of like, you know, Laird Oh, he bright light, dark shadow. I just think that’s the nature of the universe.

Brad: 00:11:57 Wow. And I guess if you can do that in a, on a public stage and then go back to your real personal life, it’s, I guess you could use that as a powerful vehicle and see the benefit of that rather than being hassled by, uh, being a public figure and feeling stressed about it.

Gabby: 00:12:18 Well, let’s be clear though, people actively pursue to be public figures, right? Unless you’re a private person that’s been ousted in a public way. Okay. Like that happens too, right? Like someone is a biproduct living a personal life and somehow got connected to a public situation. But short of that, when you live a public, when you have a job that sorta, that has public elements to it, you’re actively pursuing that. So for you to be annoyed or, or surprised is sometimes it’s ignorant. And I also understand because I have friends that are very famous, it’s easier for Laird and I cause we’re sort of in this other tier and also were both bigger. Like I’m six, three. So when I’m walking in public, people are generally pretty polite where let’s say I have friends that are very, very famous and they’re actresses, so they’re more compact or petite.

Gabby: 00:13:06 And the fact is they’re living in people’s home everyday. So people feel a familiarity with them that they may not feel with me. Right. So I think it’s also understanding all the sides. So that person who is public and highly rewarded financially and with other things, the fact that they get to do that as a job, but sometimes, you know, um, people don’t understand also that there they’re a person. But I think for me, you know, I have broken it down to like you’re occupying a space. And so, um, you know, I, the more that my life, you know, reflects who I really am, whether it’s publicly or privately, I think that that’s, that feels right to me.

Brad: 00:13:52 Oh, this could be a weird offshoot question, but you mentioned your size and Laird is a large guy, muscular guy too, and near the, uh, the, the, the supermodel volleyball ideal, a tall woman and you’re walking around in public, uh, uh, unusual. Does that affect how you think you’re perceived? Uh, in general?

Gabby: 00:14:18 Well, in certain ways I think it makes it easier. I think when you’re, you know, when I was younger, being so tall was, was pretty challenging. And then, you know, being able to use it for volleyball was quite good. I mean, there were days that you even wished you were bigger, you know, when you play against the bigger girls or girls that were so athletic that you were like, oh my God, if I could just be bigger. But I think now, I mean, at this age in my life, it isn’t about easier. It’s just you have a one little layer of protection possibly. And also, um, athletes have a different than let’s say a famous or famous musician where people have like pretty crazy responses to I think, um, I think we, we people are pretty nice to us and, and really if we lead with being friendly or nice, it’s, it’s, uh, it’s, you know, 99.9%. It’s a really positive experience.

Brad: 00:15:12 Uh, I wanted to talk to you about your book, which I think is now been several years since you wrote it. My Foot is Too Big for the Glass Slipper, a guide to a less than perfect life. How long ago did you write down?

Gabby: 00:15:26 Um, I think I wrote that book about four years ago. About four years. Yeah.

Brad: 00:15:32 Um, at that, just, I don’t know if it was destined for the female audience or what, but I remember picking it up and just was, you know, enthralled by the, the, the rawness of it and the openness and so many interesting insights. It was called a guide in the, in the subtitle. I think it’s a guide because we don’t usually talk about this stuff. We just, we just cover it up. Uh, especially when someone’s writing book, but also in, in our own personal lives, like we’re not chitchatting about these relationship difficulties or your, your fears as a parent and things like that.

Gabby: 00:16:09 I think it’s really healthy and I think, you know, people sitting, you know, originally, initially, um, maybe before we’ve created this weird world of expectation and, and such that, um, people did share, they sat whether they sat around fires or visited with each other or had tea or whatever, the versions of gathering war and, or they would go to somebody and discuss maybe some very, um, I would think typical, uh, challenges. I think we all think our problems are also unique to us. And really once we exchange with other people, we realize it’s, it’s usually not that unusual. And, and, um, even the bad, even the hard, they’re really hard and bad stuff. It’s like, even that, I think it, the more we can create space for one another to take a look at it, to really figure out how we feel about it, to figure out how we want to respond to it, how we want to grow from it. Um, if it has to do with one of our children, how we help them manage it and get through it, I think it makes that whole process a lot more seamless and to hide it or pack it away or you know, it just gnaws on you in a whole different way and keeps you from the action of improving whatever the challenges is Um, and I think once we forgo the idea of living up to the expectation of either our neighbor, our or the world around us or the ad man or whatever, um, that liberation becomes a freedom that I think everyone should be bold enough to say that I have to take for myself, my messiness, my met my life that is beautiful and messy and, and wonderful and difficult. Um, because that actually is closer to life. And I think that also we can teach that to our children. Like the hard things are a part of life that is, you know, all of life, not just everything’s perfect. You know, my marriage is perfect, my butt is perfect, my children are well behaved. Um, that’s just not, that’s not really living.

Brad: 00:18:18 It seems like we’re progressing there really quickly with the information age and the exchange of ideas and thoughts and at the same time still getting, uh, the, the, you know, the remnants of the fake culture is still still alive and well with the Kardashians 14th season and whatever else is going on in celebrity culture. But it seems like it’s a, it’s marching toward those ideals of openness and vulnerability and being able to live an authentic life. And I love how you bring up the children because, um, I have a lot of fears of what the future holds for. my kids are a little older than yours, but, um, you know, if we don’t kind of correct course and, and fix these things, uh, there’s, there’s some heavyweights, uh, over us right now.

Gabby: 00:19:08 Yeah. I think, you know, uh, you know, the generation, we have a 23, a 15 and an 11 year old. And I’ve seen not only they are going to be dealing with the distractions and the noise of technology, which is a wonderful tool in certain ways. Um, but then they’re dealing with the planet, the health of the planet. The environment and, and never getting a break, right? They’re inundated all the time with new news information, bad news. Um, you know, I always joke that like adults aren’t being even perceived as behaving very well. You know, at least like when I grew up, the perception was that they, somebody was behaving well and of course they weren’t either, but at least it looked like, okay, somebody’s doing, trying to be, you know, do the right thing. Um, and I think for them it’s going to be important though, is how do we find our authentic self even in lieu of people criticizing that because that’s the other thing. They all get that running commentary that you and I didn’t grow up with. Everyone gets to tell you what they think and feel. So it’s an interesting thing. Also, we’re, how will they get the courage to actually stand for something or a belief because you will, the nature of the beast and social commentary and all that, like you, we’ll pay a little bit of a price.

Brad: 00:20:29 Well also, do you have some concerns or some strategies, uh, for your kids to kind of shield them or help them cope with, uh, the high profile life that they’re thrust into because of their parents?

Gabby: 00:20:43 You know, we, I think there that could be, uh, maybe I’m a misconception in a certain way where in ways like Laird and I are like the most boring sort of traditional in that sense of like we’re together, we try to eat dinner together. Um, in ways we take on sort of traditional roles. Even though, you know, I work and I’m in to being athletic. There’s elements that feel traditional. So you know, if we have, let’s say for example somebody that happens to be well known, uh, performer of any kind come to the house to train, um, my kids have grown up with that. So what, what has happened for them is actually they have learned to, to measure people on who they are. And when people come with a big fancy title or all of this stuff before my kids actually have the capacity to decipher, um, and get to the person is and so, so cause we’re not like in a ton of fabulous environments, if you will. You know, like I said, Laird wants to go to bed at eight 30. So there’s so in a way, and we’re not, you know, people aren’t running around chasing us, taking our picture. That’s such a rare occasion. So my kids are pretty pretty okay there. I think the only thing that we, we’ve had to learn is how do we not thrust upon them the expectation that they need to be like us in any way. That they have their own lane and their own path. And that’s the thing I’m always trying to figure out is how do I make sure consciously that that doesn’t get communicated to them in any way. That there’s an expectation that they are supposed to live or be like us because they’re not

Brad: 00:22:26 Right. I think kids feel that anyway. And they feel like they have to measure up to their sibling if their siblings in a certain direction. And Oh man, there’s so many messages getting shoved down their throat these days, even even by their peers. And um, you know, we are, we’re now existing in the age of the helicopter parent where they’re helping your, you’re orchestrating your kid’s college application. They could be a champion volleyball player that’s never, never, uh, never spiked the ball. So I mean, where, where’s your boundary line? I mean, I know you want to be a supportive facilitating parent that, you know, help your kid realize your dreams, uh, but you know, how much his hands off and where are you guys stepping in to create their advantages?

Gabby: 00:23:09 Well, I never thought about creating your advantages. I, I think, um, uh, you know, both layer and I come from very different backgrounds as far as our backgrounds are actually quite similar, but we didn’t grow up in the mainland USA. And so our, I think our city, our, the way we look at it is maybe just a little bit different. And I, and I ended up going to college and playing volleyball on a scholarship. Um, but that was certainly was a great surprise to me. And then Laird] actually didn’t even finish high school. And so, um, I think both of us sort of feel like we’ll try to create an environment they feel safe and loved and supported and, um, and as far as advantages, like, I think that’s their own trip to navigate. I think, you know, us shielding them cause as it is, we’re already pretty, you know, things are pretty good for my kids. So in a way for me to continue to add more layers of, you know, giving them an advantage is a huge disservice to them. Um, because they’ve got to navigate. They they’ve got it. You know, I can’t say to them, well, you should grow up like your dad and I, well, that’s not happening. Um, you know, we, we have, uh, we’ve been fortunate in that we’ve made healthy living. So that in itself, yeah, it’s great. It’s an advantage. Like you can send your kid to take tennis lessons or ride horses. We couldn’t do that. Right, but it would be unfair. I’d be doing them a disservice to try to navigate their path for them because it’s, again, it goes back to it’s their genuine path. Um, now if one of them came to me and said, hey, listen, like we’ve had this recently, my 15 year old daughter has decided she’d really liked to play tennis more seriously. So she came and said, I would like to, I would like to train more. I would like to dedicate real hours to this. And so we said, okay, So that is about as far as the of that is I can do as far as like getting her cutting short cuts and all of that. Um, I’d rather see my kid not get into college quite frankly, and show them that example because there’s just so many ways to skin the cat and who am I to push onto my kids project onto them? Like, Oh, this is where you have to do it, hurt their dad. And I have done it in some of the most unconventional ways that there are. And, um, and also what are we defining as success? Are we, are we encouraging our children to say, Hey, I have a passion and a voice inside me and I’m willing to work hard for that. Um, is that or is it like, no, you need to be a lawyer or a doctor. It’s like, well, that doesn’t make success for me. So I’m really interested in my kids, um, pursuing, you know, their own path. And so, um, and actually quite frankly, I hope that they bump up against some, some obstacles because that’s how it works.

Brad: 00:26:04 Yeah. I’m, I’m starting to second guess the, the ideal of success as well and wondering, you know, you see people who maybe don’t have that natural driven competitive intensity. So they’re on the beach watching a dudes charge, big waves and they’re sitting there and listening to music and drinking out of the coconut. And then they go over to the local restaurant and have some food and some beers with their friends and go to sleep and do it again. And it seems like the world has enough, uh, champion athletes, doctors, lawyers, accountants, a UPS drivers. And so I’m wondering, you know, is there, is there an access to a more happiness from kind of choosing out to such extent that, I don’t know, maybe maybe many parents would be disappointed if they got a postcard from their kid saying, yeah, I’m still here in Costa Rica costs $9 a day and I’m going to do, we’re going to milk this puppy for another 18 months at this rate.

Gabby: 00:27:01 Yeah. I think here’s how I view that we’re, which is if there is not an internal conflict for them where, cause, you know, purpose and meaning, right. I think what happens to us is if we get older and um, why don’t we turn to alcohol or drugs or what have you. Some of it obviously could be earlier trauma or something like that, but it could also be boredom or undirected energy. And so my only, my only sort of comment on that is, is if you really feel good drinking out of the coconut and you have that sense of, you know, your own meaning and purpose, great. But I think that by tune your ass, if you think you’re going to live like that, um, because you’ll be frustrated because you didn’t get to express yourself. Um, but if, if taking it all in and having that time with your friends or doing these things that you enjoy is a reflection of how you really feel. Um, great and lucky you,

Brad: 00:28:05 Right, right. Uh, there’s, there’s probably, there’s probably more frustration then is, is evident because there’s a little voice inside. I think we all want to make a contribution and feel special and feel accomplished. Yeah.

Gabby: 00:28:21 Well that’s, you know, if you go back to tribal living, right? That was the whole thing is what can I contribute to the tribe? What is my gift? What is my talent? And listen, that’s not to say that when we see people that are very still and they’re not trying to get anywhere and they’re living, that’s a very powerful example. You know, the rest of us are all scratching around trying to obtain and get and do. And so I have a friend like this, but she does in the sense that she’s an incredible fan. She, uh, she’s built an incredible family and there’s a lot of doing in that. But what I always took from her was that she is living and she wasn’t ever in her definition trying to be someone or something. And in essence, um, then she’s exactly who she is. And so I think, you know, typically we would want to bring our talents and gifts to our tribe, but then there are people who just by their walk and their capacity to love, which this friend I’m talking about, how’s this? And also she’s up service. That’s the other thing. If you ever need help, she’s like that. So what she’s actually bringing is this attitude of love and service and um, and the rest is like, you know, like we can, it’s okay to enjoy ourselves and, and uh, I love family and, and take care of them and stuff. So again, this goes back to people really trying to drill down without what’s being told to them. What do I really want and who am I genuinely, um, and sort of have that capacity to turn that noise off. And also for people to do that, you know, throughout life. Like we do it and then we should do it again and we should do it in the three years and then five years because we keep changing.

Brad: 00:30:10 Right. Different values. Different goals.

Gabby: 00:30:12 Yeah. Yeah.

Brad: 00:30:13 Uh, so in your case, you said about your background that it wasn’t a free and easy and you quote said you weren’t groomed to be successful. You talked about being self conscious about your height and luckily you had volleyball. But um, tell me a little bit about that journey. Where did you, you’re coming into a high performing a high, you know, high volume intensity lifestyle here, and is that something that you feel like there was a, a fire lit, uh, that was caused by struggle or is this kind of your natural destiny? What are the, what are the angles?

Gabby: 00:30:51 Well, I think it’s a combination, right? I think we do all have a path and a destiny because you don’t want, especially when you’re living at all of us can say, I am so very well aware that there is good fortune being bestowed upon me. It’s nothing I’m really doing right and convert and commercially, even the bad stuff that happens when you’re younger, it’s like, Hey, I didn’t do anything to deserve this. Um, it’s, you know, it’s sort of part of something greater than us. Um, I think I was born with the capacity, uh, to do a lot of things. Meaning I have an innate work ethic. I have a pretty good ability to do many things, um, pretty concisely at, uh, you know, uh, all at once or sort of within close proximity of one another. I would, I, so it’s nothing I certainly I developed it, are homed it, but even raising my kids, like my youngest daughter, um, I can see in her certain traits that I was born with and I’m like, oh, okay, well, hopefully she, you know, uses that to her benefit. Because there’s things connected to it that are obnoxious. But, um, well, cause you see or ability to see so far down the road makes you anxious or makes you over analyze it. And it’s like, yeah, okay, shut up. Just, let’s go. Five steps, not 27. Right. And my youngest is very much like that and has always been like that. So, um, it was that it was a great deal of fear, I think as a young person sort of saying, okay, well if I don’t make this happen, it’s not going to. And uh, and then also there comes a point, though, where you have to recognize opportunity.

Gabby: 00:32:34 Go through the door even when it’s uncomfortable, take the chance, bust your ass when you get the moment and understand that none of us deserve anything, right? We, it’s sort of like having the opera, the ability to go, I’m going to be really grateful for this opportunity. Um, and, and, and just sort of maximize it and see and see where it goes. If it feels really good to me. Um, I, I tried to actually not do things that didn’t feel good to me, but, um, and then I think the other side of that is then as you move through life, how do you get motivated by other things than your old story when you’re young? You know, it’s like I even have friends that are musicians and I’m like, can you write good music out of happiness? Because it’s hard, right? A lot of good stuff comes out of torment and darkness and like, Oh, I’m so tortured. And then I got to a certain age where I was like, okay, well maybe I have lived longer on my own and I lived in my house. Um, I have created, I’ve been fortunate to be given and have created, participated in creating a really beautiful life. Can I use this to drive me? Um, and then when I found, and as silly as it sounds is when you feel really grateful most of the time, um, that keeps you motivated because you sort of say, hey listen, they, you’re the steward of whatever thing you’re holding so you can acknowledge that you’re pretty fortunate and take care of it and be a good steward or um, and use that to guide you and inspire you and motivate you to keep climbing. Um, cause it’s easy to lose the plot or use the same old story. You know, it’s like a, can’t use a story when I was 17 it’s like that story’s over. That person is over. So you gotta, you gotta move on and you can’t blame other people and doesn’t mean bad stuff doesn’t happen to great people and it is unfair. However, at some point we have to, we have to, you know, sort of rise out of those ashes and then also get new new tools and new reasons for sure.

Brad: 00:34:44 Oh my goodness. It’s got to be a more powerful motivator than that, you know, primal drive to make something of your life. And the athletes leverage this tremendously. And Michael Jordan wants to, you know, step on your throat and, and, and keep winning and keep winning. But a lot of times we see these highly successful people are poorly adjusted. They might even make it all the way up to a high political office, let’s say for example, or, or any other example. And they don’t seem, some of these high performers don’t seem happy because they probably haven’t leveraged what you just described, which is the gratitude that drives you to, to be in service primarily. And I guess in the case of a performer, the services to, you know, make people happy, including yourself.

Gabby: 00:35:32 I want to also realize to be able to stand on the stage and someone says, I’ll buy tickets to come you. Pretty lucky. Pretty lucky. And I think the notion of, you know, before we used to comment like when they talked about, oh, renaissance men and all this stuff and say people who appreciated athleticism comes and art and into philosophy and all these things. I do think actually, and it certainly, it’s hard to do, especially when you’re really dedicated to some thing. Like I’m married to somebody who is dedicated to something for real. Um, and I see him always making an attempt to be a good father, to stay open to learning, you know? Um, and does he skew more towards his mission? Yes, of course he does. And so I think when people are really good at something, I in music or sports, things like that, sometimes they don’t keep working on trying to open up, um, the balance on envelope just enough.

Gabby: 00:36:26 Because then also the interesting part is like when your life is like the collateral damage is a complete nightmare. So it was like, awesome, you’ve made $1 billion and like your life is a disaster. So I think at a certain point, and that’s usually more common than not. So for me, I’m always really intrigued by people who they have that, you know, special gift. They landed it in the right situation to develop that gift and express that gift. Um, but somehow they sort of haven’t lost the plot in the interim. Um, because selfishly it’s like, I really think that that’s only the way we can feel versions of happiness. I don’t think we walk around when they can feel so happy, but like that good peace feeling. I think it doesn’t come from I’m a winner. I’m really rich. I’m really powerful. Um, those things are nice. I just don’t think that there are the end game.

Brad: 00:37:23 Wow, that’s heavy. I mean, uh, if someone’s struggling to make it work, uh, what would you say to them? And when, when you’re asking people to be motivated by gratitude and the, the, the present, the present difficulty is so high. Maybe going back and talking to your teenage self or especially young people, I’m thinking of where they’re just trying to figure everything out and they don’t have any perspective to, to lean on. What do we go?

Gabby: 00:37:55 You know, I, I mean, I can share ideas. I certainly know how unqualified I am, um, to give too much advice. But, um, teenagers is, it’s the hardest. Um, because also I didn’t, I didn’t grow up with the device and what they’re contending with is something that I, I won’t even pretend to understand what it’s like to try to develop as a person with my own understanding of who I am and, or some version of that and a belief system and deal with my peers. Um, and you know, transitioning into a young adulthood and all these things with this device and the time in the world that we live in. Um, but I think, for example, if somebody has had anything that’s, that’s bad that’s happened to them, I think it’s really important to communicate that with somebody that they trust and sort of clear the decks on that and start to a real process of looking at that because that’s something then then that ends up re, you know, sort of stunting so many other things. We’re just going to try to venture into whether it’s a work or relationships. So if you’re a young person, um, I think it’s important to have a safe place to really show who you are and also have to share anything that, that you want. And if you’re a little bit older, it’s kind of the practice of looking at what’s magical about life. Um, you know, is it the color of the sky when you’re driving? Is it recognizing? Uh, just there’s very sweet moments everywhere that if we, if we’re willing to just notice and I think it adds to the, sort of, the tapestry of like, there is a lot of beauty in life. I just also have to be willing to recognize it. Um, it doesn’t mean there isn’t hard times. Um, and then every time, like for example, I was just telling a friend of mine, if you have a hard time, um, these are the opportunities, right?

Gabby: 00:39:52 This is it. Like, okay, this is, this is my opportunity to not only show what I made up, but it’s also an opportunity to probably learn something important. And also the less I resist it, most likely the quicker I can get through it. You know, I think when we resist things and we have conflict and we’re so definitive about our beliefs about things, um, we’re going to be in that state of resistance. And I think, um, it, you know, if we can flow even when it’s hard, I think it will, it spits out sooner, if you know what I mean. Um, and, and I hate to say it, but life has a learning, a level of acceptance, uh, to things doesn’t mean you can’t change things or improve them. But starting with acceptance and also accountability, because then, then you give yourself the power. So for a young person, if you don’t like something, you could blame your parents your whole life. You could cause we screw up. But that takes the power out of your hands. So for any person, I always say keep the power. Uh, Quincy Jones says, uh, childhood trauma has an expiration date. I agree. And I, and I, and then it can be very liberating. And unfortunately there’s people who have stuff that’s really, really heavy to deal with. And, um, and even with them, it’s like, but there’s still so much life to live and there’s so much beauty, and I know that’s easier said than done, but, um, it is possible and I feel like it’s people’s right. It is their right. And so the quicker we can sort of gather up our feelings and our power, um, then I think are the quicker we can make our life sort of the, the picture that we see in our mind. Because every person is born with this picture of what their life is. And it could be completely different than the one they’re born too. And that’s so great. Um, but if we’re sitting there going, oh, this happened and they did this and that, Eh, you know, it, that’s a hard thing to navigate out of.

Brad: 00:42:03 Pretty heavy. Everyone gets to take one breath now and let that soak in. Uh, let’s, let’s say for argument’s sake that you’re really good at this stuff so you can handle, uh, the ups and downs more so than the next person. I’m going thinking back to that book where you’re detailing this, uh, this relationship with Laird. Then it was a wild and, uh, immediate at the start. You moved in after eight days together and then you filed for divorce a few years later and then this happened in a public stage and that happened on the public stage and you’re making it work. And uh, everyday’s, uh, a wonderful adventure that you continue to sign up for. And I’m wondering, it seems like some other people, different type of personality is just incapable of those ups and downs and requires something different out of life and therefore, uh, you know, gets, gets knocked to the ground from a minor, a detour on the, on the road to the yellow brick road. And how do they, how do they, uh, how do they work on that part of themselves? Is it, is it, is it a need or can you, can you take steps toward going with the flow better?

Gabby: 00:43:19 I think we all have the capacity. I think I obviously certain things it’s like flexibility or strength or certain things. Like some of us have other traits more naturally than others. Right. And I think there’s certain things maybe we come with where you look at the person and then you go, God, they do that so well, think somebody who’s good at math or something. Um, but yeah, I mean, I think all of us, um, this is, this is how I look at it. It isn’t about, oh, I can’t do that. It’s going, okay. So that doesn’t come easily to you. So what out there can help you create a system and a practice that helps you be able to feel and respond the way you’re looking to. And I think that people have to realize that it is a practice. So even, I mean, I have a, I would say for the last 18 years I’ve had a pretty harmonious relationship with Laird. And that early bump was kind of me learning, having some really big lessons, but also it’s even like my training and eating, I wake up each day and I still have to exercise my practice of, okay, I’m going to choose to eat this. Um, if I’m in a bad mood, I’m not going to take it on my family, you know? And so people have to put it also consciousness, I think into their thoughts, their words, who they’re with, um, and, and find like, you know, I was, uh, listening, uh, recently to Byron Katie and she, you know, she has this program called The Work and it’s literally like, they have worksheets and stuff. Like, it’s like, it isn’t like, okay listen, we’re going to talk about a couple of concepts and you’re good to go. It’s like, no, this is a, it’s like a meditation practice. This is a practice.

Gabby: 00:45:03 And sometimes we wake up each day and we can look at life as a practice where you’re going to do, do your very best. Then all of a sudden that kind of builds upon itself. Like you can be like, there’s my ego. Oh, okay, here’s my fear. Oh, okay. Um, this is the worst food I eat. This doesn’t support me. Maybe I can eliminate the single worst food or the worst habit. Um, I’m gonna make my bed each day. Why task completion right now? If you’re a teenager, I get it. It’s brains doing different things. I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about creating systems that help you navigate life, whether certain diet, cause also what’s it hard for? Somebody in one area is going to be easier for them. And conversely, what might be easier for me might be a real challenge. And, um, and so I think it’s about recognizing like, no, we can’t do it alone and nobody has the answers. But practice is pretty important.

Brad: 00:46:00 Well, oh, I’m reflecting on the importance of fitness in my life, my entire life. Same for you. And I don’t know any different. So I’m, I’m assuming maybe this stuff is way more important than I give it credit for because I don’t miss that many workouts or I’m, you know, always stretching or doing, doing something rather than sitting around. And um, now we’re having scientific research showing that your, your brain oxygenation and blood flow is affected by your movement patterns. And being able to, to adhere to a dietary protocol probably carries over into all manner of other things in life. I’m, I’m super big on the chest freezer, cold plunge now every morning and I’ve been doing that for about two years straight. And for me, cause I’m a freewheeling guy and I can do whatever I want with my day. The fact that I can tell you and the public, like, I jumped in this 36 degree water every day. I know there’s health benefits and no hormone boost, but just to be able to have that pattern in place. I’m, I’m hoping and I, I assume I’m leveraging that to my amount of discipline I apply when I’m working on a book or, or trying not to take out my anger on my family as you described.

Gabby: 00:47:16 Yeah, I think, listen, personal accountability, um, I even say like, let’s say I have an argument with Laird let’s say, and it’s something we actually tried to avoid. Um, or just, you know, it’s not a good, it’s not a good look. Um, and let’s say I’m going to, I’m going to say this a few years, maybe 15 years ago, I had this thought while I’m right, cause Laird is a much more humble kind of gracious person in certain ways than I am. And, um, and so, uh, I always said, okay, we can have this conflict and let’s say I am right for argument’s sake, whatever that means. But within it, within the discussion, if he makes a point and it’s only 10% of the discussion, let’s say 5% but he has a point. What I started to do is look at it and go, okay, the big part of the conversation, if we were saying right and wrong, I was right, but what’s important for me to focus on is his point. If he has a point in there, because if it helps me be better and me learn, I have to be willing to listen to that and hear it and not just be like, well I’m right, but to just to look and and so within that, again, this goes back to we could look at our life and go, this is unfair and that’s unfair and this happened to me and they did this to me and I was born like this and I’m this tall and I weigh this much. Or we could say what’s pretty good? What’s great, what’s the starting point? Even if at that time it feels like it’s such a small part of what we think is the whole pile because then we again can take charge and build upon, but we have to be willing to take charge if we sit in the, you know, on the couch and blame everything and everyone, and also by the way, there’s a little bit of uncomfortable work that must happen.

Gabby: 00:49:21 We’ve got to stress ourselves in positive ways. We just do, expansion happens. And so it’s not about trying to find drama with your loved ones and not to stress, no. How do we exert like your ice? That’s not going to hurt anyone. That’s a positive stress. So it doesn’t mean taking up something you didn’t want. Does it mean going walking a little further than you did the day before? If you’re just starting out again, is it not changing your whole lifestyle but saying, okay, um, I love Diet Soda. It’s time for me to give it up. Just creating positive stresses and discipline. You know, these are parts of kind of putting it together. Um, and it’s completely unavoidable and I don’t care who you are. I don’t care if you’re Laird, who can deal with like the most discomfort and has trained more than any person I know. Guess what, when he wakes up each day, you’re earning it that day. Your, your relationships, your work, your, you know, it’s all of it. It’s like we don’t arrive. It’s a living moving dynamic that also, by the way, we could also, there’s so many opportunities to make so many things even better each day. Um, we won’t be younger each day but, but, but that’s life. So I think it’s about, uh, you know, kind of going well in which way could I be better today and, and, and we can be in charge of that. So I would motivate people to see where the Chink in the armor is. Cause it’s really good to know yourself and be and be like, okay, what can I do to help support myself and um, and work from there.

Brad: 00:51:09 Well, back to the argument where if you have a desire to be in a loving, productive relationship, by definition, the person has a point if they think they have a point and they’re, their point might’ve been, uh, my, my feelings were hurt when you did this or said this and your first reaction is, that’s so ridiculous. You’re, you’re wrong. And then you’re down. You’re, you’re going down the wrong road. So

Gabby: 00:51:34 That never works. That never works.

Brad: 00:51:38 Right?

Gabby: 00:51:39 Well, that’s also our trigger because the idea that we heard the person we love makes us very afraid instead of saying, okay, um, can you explain what you mean? And that certainly was not my intention. I, and by the way, it took me a good solid seven years to, to freely find the way to say I’m sorry. It was very hard for me because the way I grew up, I had to secure and hold onto my own truth so desperately because I didn’t have people around me that I really could trust. So I had to be so definitive about what I was thinking and feeling that it also made it be like really hard for me to say I was sorry. And with Laird he has taught me that. But we just have to realize if we’re triggered, why are we triggered? And we certainly can’t tell people how they’re feeling. You know, you can’t tell anyone. We’ll that you’re not feeling that well, no, no they are. And um, and it’s so much quicker. This goes back to when we don’t put up resistance. You can get through it like that. I mean, they can say, well this hurts my feelings. And you can say, Oh did I? Okay, well can you explain to me how, and you know what, I’m so sorry. That was not my intention. And let me tell you, that’s actually more important than never hurting their feelings. Because if they can say, I can go to this person with my feelings and trust them to handle it carefully and that will inspire me the next time I’m feeling something to say something. And you become a safe person and then hopefully you inspire them to be a safe person. And, and then you can, you can have your feelings. Cause we all have our feelings. I mean, you know, feelings

Brad: 00:53:26 If you’re both safe, you then have some emotional control, emotional stability built into the relationship where you can share without the, the, the drama and the emotional charge that we see in dysfunction. Now you think that would be the ultimate goal.

Gabby: 00:53:43 But that’s why we have to try to find ways to be productive and challenged positively in life. Because if we’re not, we definitely will look for it, some action somewhere. And so it’s probably with a partner and being like, you know what? I’m a little bored. Let’s lighten this up a little bit. So that’s why I think getting out there and trying to like make your life colorful with stuff that like works in your favor and experience things because then you won’t need to have that as much at home. I mean, hopefully you have excitement and you know, uh, growth and, and certainly healthy challenges, you know, their challenges me all the time, um, and passion and things like that. But hopefully it won’t have to be like, I get all my excitement from creating friction with my partner.

Brad: 00:54:36 Oh my goodness. I’m, I’m thinking of, uh, Bruce Lipton’s book, Biology of Belief where he says with great scientific support that we’re operating from the subconscious 95 to 99% of the time in life. And so becoming conscious, we use that as a buzzword to, to identify a good behavior, but we don’t even realize that we thrive on drama and conflict and we’ll create it when we get bored or unfulfilled in other ways. And that one was pretty heavy cause um, if your, if your pattern behavior is ruling the show almost all the time, wow. It could cause some could costs some trouble and some pain and suffering until you, until you wake up and realize what’s going on the next time you have a, uh, a knitpick back and forth with coworker, partner, kid, whatever.

Gabby: 00:55:24 Yeah. I think it’s uh, you know, listen, in some ways it’s sort of like easier just to like shoot your emotions everywhere and be like, oh, you know, screw them and oh gee, I did it. And all these things are sort of reframe willingness. I mean the other takes a level of like a self restraint discipline almost. You hold your tongue sometimes until you to go, okay, let me hear the words and let me not react, respond, let me really hear what they’re saying. Um, however, in the long run I feel like is so much, it just creates opportunity more expansive and, and have a relationship that, uh, whether it’s with your children or your friends or whatever, where, listen, I’m not where someone could go, you know, Gabby’s not a perfect person and I like, here’s all her flaws, but there’s this, there she does create safe space. Um, and, and I had, I had to learn that in the hardest people that to learn that for actually my children because I’m not objective. I can actually almost be objective even with Laird with my own kids. I wasn’t objective. So I even within there I had to learn how to listen without fixing or changing or telling them, shifting how they felt, whether it had to do with me or not. Um, and just, you know, be, and make that space for them too, and not react to everything they said or, or even said to me about me. Um,

Brad: 00:56:53 wow.

Gabby: 00:56:55 That, and that’s an ongoing, by the way.

Brad: 00:56:57 Oh, it was just going to ask, like at what point, at what point do you step in? At what point do you just there as the listening mom? That’s a battle at the challenge. It’s a, it’s ongoing. And sometimes like I took my little girl to school today and I was like, you know, she, she’s pretty tough. Like she’s a kid, you can say, well, how was your school day today? And she’s like, I don’t really want to talk about school. And after you do that like eight times in a row, then the, my personality, because I’m, it’s very comfortable for me to be quiet. I’m an only child. Um, I actually have to work in different ways at being messy and open and all these things and partners like, yeah, fine, I don’t need to ask this kid like how her day is, you know, like I don’t, but, but within that it’s like I’m her mom, so I’ve got to be the adult in that way. Like be a good example. And I, I have no right to say, you know, it hurts my feelings when, you know, I asked you how your day is and you know you’re hurt Mommy’s feelings when you say you don’t want to talk about it because now I’m using guilt. Right.? That’s inappropriate. She was very clear with her feelings. She doesn’t want to talk about her day. And then I started getting insecure as a parent. Like, well, I mean, is it an parental, if I don’t ask her how her day is cause it’s the ninth day and I’m, part of me is I guess screw that. I’m not asking her how her day is. Right. So even within that, I’m always trying to work on like fair play, not putting my crap on them. And also there’ll be like, yeah, I’m good. I, I’m, I’m cool like 15 times and that behavior, I’m a, I can take a little space. So those are, they’re the hardest ones I think to, um, to artfully make space for her, not saved them from every heartache and not distract them with like how great their life is. That’s why they shouldn’t be sat over here and like that, you know, it’s like you just have to work on adults sometimes. Yeah. And it’s like, so I’m even trying, you know, so I think even to that, it’s like to listen and to be there and to be loving and to not make it about me and my crap as often as I can and I fail as much as I pull it for sure. Maybe last, I don’t know.

Brad: 00:59:12 Well, speaking to that safe space, if you become that way as a parent, then predictably, uh, when the kid needs to open or have someone to confide in, it might not be till she’s 15 or it might not be when you on your time schedule. I remember my, my epic, uh, occasion with my son who was, you know, very competitive, high school basketball player and they just had a devastating loss in a championship game and it was about a three hour drive back home. And I got in the car and I thought to myself, maybe this is, you know, time to let him talk first and just be quiet. Cause I had all kinds of things to say about the substitution patterns of the coach and whatever happened. And uh, that car was silent for 90 minutes and after 20, I was feeling very uncomfortable and wondering if I should say something, but I said, I’m not going to be the first guy to cave, you know, and then, uh, we, we got to the next town, where we stopped at Chipotle And that was the first words that came out. And then it was a steady stream for the next 90 minutes of the three hour drive him, you know, unloading nonstop and processing everything. And me thinking that I was being helpful. But if I had done so much to say one sentence in that first 90 minutes, we couldn’t have had a fork in the road.

Gabby: 01:00:23 I think it’s really powerful when a parent gives that space to their child, to they, for them really to tell you how they’re feeling. Um, you know, and, and, um, as uncomfortable as it can be for us, I think, um, you are reinforcing that they can come and talk to you, that you don’t always have to cast your opinion on it. And, uh, you know, get the checklist, whip it into the list and you know, and solve everything and, um, and just to be a person who listens to them and, and, um, and then hopefully they go into their adult life with that, with that skill set. Right? And, and also realizing like, oh, see there are people in the world who listen and this person isn’t one of them. So I don’t know if I’m comfortable being friends with them or dating them. So I think it’s really a powerful, powerful thing. And then hopefully, maybe they know how to do it for other people, you know, where, um, you know, you just, you know, listen,

Brad: 01:01:23 Oh yeah. We forgot about that aspect of parenting that maybe your kid’s going to be a parent someday and you’re setting, setting a, the positions. Wow. Love it. So your, your fitness commitment, uh, what is it like today and what does it represent in terms of achieving that balance in life or that, that stress management and that mindfulness?

Gabby: 01:01:47 Well, you know, listen, I think it’s easier to have a sound mind if you are working on having us somewhat healthy body and, and you know, certainly I used to be all about performance and then it is still about performance. Uh, I would like to have a high level of vitality, life force and be able to move and do the things I want to do and play. But um, uh, it also helps me armor up against my many, uh, emotional flaws and the games that my mind likes to play on me. So I feel like when my, my body is like, I always joke, it’s the cheapest therapy that you can have. It’s like, okay, I just had an ass kick workout. I’m just a much more clear, you know, adaptable, sort of reasonable human being. And so I think it’s, it becomes that too. And, and, and listen, there are days I’m or, or periods of time, I’m less fired up than others and that’s for sure. And that’s natural and I know how to get through those. But, um, you know, I always say it was both, a lot of people don’t have a lot of extra resources to throw at exercise, so whether that’s time or money. Um, and then the other more important component of that is that they actually haven’t made it clear to themselves why it’s important. And so, um, you will never have any time or extra dollars to throw at it if you’ve not really genuinely arrived at the place where you, you know, it’s important. So I learned a long time ago, you know, a long time ago, more than 30 years ago, I understood that it was important. And, um, and so, um, I’m committed. I’ve taken the emotion out of that. Um, probably in my early twenties, I took the emotion out of like, I don’t feel like it, it’s like, okay.

Brad: 01:03:39 iYeah, that’s, that’s a big secret right there. I mean, you don’t have to ask yourself if you’re motivated or not, or you’re in the perfect emotional state to go to the gym and lift some kettle bells. You just do it. Automatic behavior.

Gabby: 01:03:54 Yeah. It’s just, you know, if the, if it creeps in, like, ah, I’d say, you know, on, and the only time I don’t, the only time I really honor myself is when I don’t feel good. Like if I’m genuinely, genuinely tired or I’m in a place emotionally that it’s actually not going to be good for me. It would be better for me to stretch or do some breathing and not kick my ass with a bunch of hard metal. And maybe I’m too much metal at that moment and I need something soft and watery or Airish or something other. But that’s after years of doing it when I don’t want to do it. So I’m, I’m comfortable with knowing that I’m probably being decently honest with myself about that.

Brad: 01:04:43 I was going to ask you how you, how you balance everything and manage all these disparate roles since you’re busy Gal. We can, we can end up on that. Cause I’m sure you have a busy day and I noticed um, some secrets have come up. One of them at the star of the show you said you and Laird have a boring lifestyle. And then the other one I read on your website was this, uh, practice of active ignoring. Oh yeah. So tell us about active ignoring and how boring you are. Cause it seems like a hard to imagine that you guys are boring when every other day there’s something, there’s something popping up.

Gabby: 01:05:19 Well I think, um, you know, as far as active ignoring, I used to joke like sometimes, and I know actually, um, husbands and boyfriends do this quite a bit because I do think and people can say whatever they want. Women typically like to talk more than men and we like to sort of talk about all kinds of things that have nothing to do with really an end result or a solution. We just sort of like, it’s talk about stuff and I’m a female that actually talks a lot less than other females and I know compared to Laird in certain ways. I’m, I would like to talk and I’ve seen him actively listening, but he’s probably ignoring like think about a guy who has been with his wife for 50 years, you know, and she’s like, blah, blah blah blah blah. And he’s like, and sometimes like with kids, it’s like a, I used to joke that I, I’m not going to go up and down on the roller coaster with everything they’re doing and I want them to feel that I’m there. So I’m actively kind of ignoring them at the same time. And that’s also to protect myself because, um, I mean I, I live with a lot of, I have a family, like I live with a lot of people. Like the joke is like I used to joke and come home and be like, you know, who are all these people in my house? And I’m like, oh, it’s my family. And so just almost sometimes almost taking little moments to protect yourself, meaning you know the part of you that’s trying to stay balanced and fair and reasonable and thoughtful and conscious. Well you can’t do that when you’re just like out here everywhere. So sometimes there’s correct opportunities to kind of go inside yourself a little bit and build a nice little kind of bubble around that person and restore them throughout the day so they can continue trying to be all those things throughout the day. Cause otherwise you could see me on the days I don’t do it at six o’clock and I’m like, I’m at, I could be out of my mind or I have had maybe three times a year. I might just, I tap out, it’s like 7:00 PM and I look at Laird and I’m like, I’m going to bed, like dinner’s done. And I literally, I walk away because I know I hate everyone or I, I’m like, oh, this is this. I didn’t sign up for this BS, you know, and like I’m in that thinking, so I’m like, okay, just go to bed. You know, cause I didn’t protect the, the human in me that’s trying to, you know, be cool. And uh, and so she, she got, she got her ass kicked and now she’s crazy. Um, so that’s one. And as far as like doing everything or whatever, I think it’s just everybody’s doing a lot and we have to realize that most of it’s our choice.

Gabby: 01:08:13 Most of it and who are really doing a lot are people who are working two and three jobs to get the lights on. That’s doing a lot because you’re doing everything you can to do kind of the basics. And so that’s working a lot. That’s doing a lot. What I’m doing is I have a lot of opportunities and I’m navigating them and organizing them. That’s it. That’s not doing a lot. And uh, I’m very clear about that. And, uh, as far as boring, it’s like, you know, we don’t drink, we’re not, you know, we’re not doing drugs. We go to bed early. Because I think both of us independently and together are clear that practice that we talked about, I think it feels pretty important. And, uh, and part of that is like being your biological animal, which is like, okay, let’s go to bed.

Brad: 01:09:09 You said independently. So you, you both bring an independent commitment and then I guess in nurture that in the partnership as well.

Gabby: 01:09:17 Yeah, like Laird would not be different in so many ways if I was not married to him. I would be more different. Quite frankly, I would have a much more like going to dinner, nighttime social, not like partying because I’ve never been a party or even when I lived in New York City at 18 by myself modeling, I never was a party or that’s not my deal. Um, it’s more about like seeing friends and doing that at night where it’s like get all that done in the day. Um, but Laird would be, uh, I think he would be less out in the world if I wasn’t his partner. I think you all would see a lot less of Laird. Here’s you Laird or no Laird. Um, but as far as his daily practice, that bugger would be doing exactly what he’s doing. And I think that’s important. I think you’ve got to enhance each other, but ultimately in some way it’s got to feel like it’s your values systems living and being able to breathe together within the unity. Not Okay, we’re all sacrificing for this person’s value system or all that person. It’s like, no, it’s gotta be both, you know, being reflected. Um, yeah, they’re always like, it looks like you guys do all the fun stuff when I leave. Like if he goes out of town, I’m like, yeah, because you want to go to bed at 8:30 and if we got to stay up till 10, like, you know, so,

Brad: 01:10:37 Oh, love it. Gabby. Thank you so much for spending the time. I always, I always appreciate your insights. What are we a, what do you got going now? Where should we go follow you, check you out, what’s happening? I’m not worried about any of that you can find or people don’t worry. Gabby Reece, one of a kind you can find me. Definitely, definitely get the book. I listened to the audio book and that was, that was fun and games being here for six hours.

Gabby: 01:11:04 Yeah. Supposed to be fun and, and um, I think, I just hope that all people realize like that they do the work to figure out it works for them. Whether it’s the movement, the eating, the type of life or job you want to have. If like I could represent anything and Laird and I, and we talk about this a lot, it’s just that like, just to remind people like, you know, it is hard to be true to yourself and scary. Um, but really what’s the alternative? And so why not give it a go while you’re here,

Brad: 01:11:39 Why not people go do it. Be Yourself. Thank you Gabby Reece. Thank you.



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